Coronavirus discussion

[Quercus]

- SNIP_ How sure someone that died was from covid, since everything is covid you dont know if its inflenza or something else...

The COVID-19 tests out there aren't just identifying any old virus - they do have some degree of accuracy. As for what degree that is, I can't find a number in a quick search, but the concern seems to be the potential for false negatives rather than false positives. Influenza tests also exist so it should be possible to distinguish the two, maybe not 100% but certainly enough to be useful.

I think one of the things that makes it so hard to understand what's going on is that the virus itself causes so many variable effects in its hosts, i.e. us. Doctors and medical researchers are still identifying those effects as clusters of different physiological effects become more obvious in the people infected. One thing they do know is that the interactions between virus and host are highly variable and complex. There are still a lot of unknowns and that adds to the fear factor and confusion about this terrible situation.

[Greyfeather]

Yeah, this is the most frightening part of COVID19 to me. I was reading an account written by a nurse about her husband's hospitalization for the virus and the fact that his doctors could not agree on treatment plans because his symptoms were just straight-up bizarre. Of course, as a nurse, she knew a lot already so was second-guessing everything. If it were my Guy in this situation I would not know who to believe (healthcare here isn't the best despite being an enormous Medical District that likes to boast about itself).

I don't have kids but I was talking to a nurse today whose child will be entering kindergarten in the Fall. She's worried and I would be too. Well I AM very worried. These atypical symptoms seem to be most common in the young and very young. Who knows what kind of fallout from throwing kids together now? The idea of thousands of parents (who may not have healthcare themselves) being thrown into super panic mode won't be pretty. The nurse said she didn't know how her 5 year old would deal with sitting all day in a mask. I wish they could at least hold off on schooling until January. I'm guessing that many parents just won't let their kids attend. I don't know the laws. I suppose they can set up home-schooling?

Off topic: My mom is in assisted living and she has not even been permitted to go out on the campus for a walk since March. I can't believe how well she's handling it. I got to see her from 8 feet away last Saturday (for 3 minutes). It's a good thing she couldn't see my face because there were tears. These folks NEED emotional and physical comfort (even babies die without it). I want to hug her so badly

[Quercus]

>Snip<

Off topic: My mom is in assisted living and she has not even been permitted to go out on the campus for a walk since March. I can't believe how well she's handling it. I got to see her from 8 feet away last Saturday (for 3 minutes). It's a good thing she couldn't see my face because there were tears. These folks NEED emotional and physical comfort (even babies die without it). I want to hug her so badly

This makes me so sad. You're so right about people needing the emotional and physical comfort of their fellow humans, especially from loved ones. It must be so hard on you not to be able to just hug your mom as tight as you can. That's one of the insidious things about this pandemic. The possibility of losing someone we love is hanging over all of us, especially if that someone is in assisted living or a nursing home. I know when I'm faced with the possibility of losing someone I treasure, my immediate reaction is to want to spend time with that person. To touch them, hug them. And yet that is the very thing that can increase the chance of losing that someone. It's heartbreaking, it really is.

There is something else that I think people need, too. I'm all for following every precaution but I don't really understand why people aren't able to go outside for a walk. Surely, at an assisted living facility on its own campus, there's a way to practice social distancing so residents can get some fresh air, sunshine and access to nature. Being around green beings is important spiritually, even if those green beings are just in the form of a manicured lawn. People NEED to get outside and it should be possible to do that.

[INSENSE3]

Hope everyone is having as nice a time as possible with loved ones, if possible, for this holiday. Celebrating freedom is quite odd when we know that every disaster brings more loss of freedom and this disaster is the mother of all disasters. Very strange and stressful. I’m lucky enough to have been quarantined with my mom for this whole time. So hugging her is an option but she’s not a hugger like I am. I’m immune compromised, so my hugging has given me viruses enough times to know I must curtail that natural instinct and I hate not hugging. Small price to pay compared to the losses of many others. That is not lost on me.
Full support of natural human emotions of anger and fear and more with many loved ones lost to this disaster,
Virtual hugs,

Laurie
INSENSE3

[herbalhippie]

I've had exactly one hug since the middle of March. Not even my own kids

however I was very happy with the hug I did get because it was from a very handsome gentleman that smells good.

[MikeEdoessomething]

Welp, tonight will be my first shift back at work at The Cheesecake Factory since March 16th I believe. Not excited (have to work to keep employment and quitting means losing all unemployment benefits in NC ) So going to rant, which I may delete eventually, but fuck it I want to vent a bit before I go to sleep

Masks are required for staff (smart) and for guests, EXCEPT when guests are at their tables they do not have to wear masks and talk as loud as they want and cough/sneeze/scream and otherwise spew droplits in the hot inside dining room Enclosed spaces where people gather for lengthy periods of time without masks are basically covid hot spots. Dining inside restaurants and the service industry is not going to be the same for a long long time. And honestly dine-in should not be open; it is not safe because people can not eat/drink with masks on, and servers have to be in close contact with guests to take orders/deliver food. If masks are required for safety, then it therefore not safe to have people without masks interacting with staff in close distance and over prolong period of contact. Wearing masks is to protect others, yet what protects staff from those not wearing a mask? Not to mention the way a virus can spread through silverware/glasses/plates that are being passed between different people over and over again. Eating inside restaurants will only continue to further spread covid, and most places are not following any "guidelines" (lucky if they are doing the bare minimum) and good luck getting cooks to wear masks/gloves all the time At the very least, if dine-in is allowed, require masks when speaking with servers/staff and when not eating/drinking (this will never happen of course, but some places are at least asking guests to weak masks when in contact with servers/staff)... I and many thousands of other servers/bussers/etc would most likely lose our jobs if all states did not allow guests to dine-in, and the bar and restaurant industries will have to change moving forward. But we're going to lose our jobs if the economy collapses and the healthcare system is overwhelmed and staff get sick/die and family members die. The ripple effects of this virus spreading like wildfire - left unchecked and out of control - has the potential to burn this country to the ground. Our society is so connected (and fragile) that if the healthcare system collapses a lot of other systems will follow as a result. There is a saying I always liked:"Destruction breeds creation." Life goes on unless you die

I have been the company for 15 years but I do not know how much longer I will continue serving and stay in the industry, considering my father's health and him being in the highest risk category and I take care of my parents. I have probably already said too much (enough to be identified if co-workers read these posts), but my employer has handled the return to work about as bad as can be. Especially the store I am at in Raleigh. Zero communication. Not to mention at least 4 co-workers in my store have had family/close contacts test positive in the past 3 weeks and they are now in quarantine. But everything is being kept as secretive as possible, and staff is not even told when an employee has been exposed (even if they may have been exposed by working with that employee). Staff has been subtle warned not to ask questions, and only if an employee tests positive will *anything* be done, and who knows what that'll be (some places where this has happened have done a "deep cleaning" and stayed open ). Most of the staff only care about themselves so they don't care about health or safety of others... Needless to safe this situation is stressful and fucking sucks for everyone. Just do curbside or delivery if you want to support a business.

To end this rant on a positive note: this may just be the inspiration for me to move on, do something or work somewhere else. Have a great 4th of July everyone.

[herbalhippie]

I agree, indoor dining is a disaster waiting to happen. Since mid-March, my son and I have eaten food we didn't prepare at home a total of 5 times and those only because it was something we'd bring home and either finish cooking or re-heat for at least 10 minutes.

But what are restaurants going to do? It's either re-open or go out of business.

My job puts me around a lot of people in close quarters too. I'm seriously thinking about a new job but dammit, I was going to retire in a couple years anyway, I really do not want to go looking for a new job at this late stage in the game.

[MikeEdoessomething]

I agree, indoor dining is a disaster waiting to happen. Since mid-March, my son and I have eaten food we didn't prepare at home a total of 5 times and those only because it was something we'd bring home and either finish cooking or re-heat for at least 10 minutes.

But what are restaurants going to do? It's either re-open or go out of business.

My job puts me around a lot of people in close quarters too. I'm seriously thinking about a new job but dammit, I was going to retire in a couple years anyway, I really do not want to go looking for a new job at this late stage in the game.

I know, most restaurants won't survive without dine-in. I do know for Cheesecake Factory, they could. On Mother's Day, for example, the location I work at made around $$42,000 dollars just curbside/to-go only!! Normally the sales for Mother's Day would be around $70,000 thousand dollars. So they made over half of what they expected WITHOUT 80-90% of the staff they would have had. They were breaking even company wide with margins/stocks I believe, if not making profit, with curbside only. For a leader in the industry Cheesecake Factory could take a stance and do what is right for safety of guests and staff. I mean, they refused to pay rent in April (and May from what I've heard) and they could afford too stay afloat, but they also could afford to not pay rent cause malls want their presence to drive in foot traffic. So they lead the #Rent strike but don't care about a #virus-strike apparently

It is truly a lose-lose situation for bars/clubs and restaurants. I think the industries will have to adopt, change business models, but most will fail. Maybe new business will spring up. (Or godforbid the government actually helped out like other countries in Europe so businesses didn't have to re-open to survive ughhh). But yeah, a lot of people would lose jobs, and all the hardships that will come from losing employment. America screwed up the first shutdown so bad, that a second shutdown will have even greater worse impacts. But on the other hand not shutting down will have EVEN GREATER WORSE IMPACTS than a second shutdown And many experts in different fields easily predicted this. We had one shot as a country to get it right or else pay some long lasting consequences. We're getting the consequences it seems. We'll continue this cycle of spreading the virus and if the healthcare industry goes, everything else will too. As long as in-door dining occurs while there is mass spread of covid (50,000+ new cases three days in a row) the virus will continue to spread and cause havoc on the economy and healthcare and our well-being. It can not last and when the fragile hold keeping society together breaks, we'll that is how The Hunger Games begin (of The Road or Mad Max, you get the point )

Since America likes choosing the lesser of two evils for President ( )-- Millions of lost jobs is better than millions of lost lives (and the jobs those lost lives had). Please America let's not have millions of lost lives with millions of lost jobs. Let's pick the less shitty version of those two choices (since America seems only capable of having to pick the lesser of two evils option ugh) But that is likely asking too much since wearing a mask has become a divisive political issue (this is all great material for an inspiring writer such as myself, well, except for all the despair and stress and this whole virus-great depression economy thing. Suddenly I'm into dark humor )

If you want to get an idea of the current Server life, check out https://www.reddit.com/r/TalesFromYourServer/ (the stories will make you laugh and cry and lose all hope but there's lots and lots of new "Karen" stories that are funny )

[herbalhippie]

haha I love the Karen stories and videos. There was an Instagram page up for a while, I saw it mentioned in Reddit somewhere, called KarenGoneWild or something like that. It got really popular really fast and then it was gone.

It was better than r/PublicFreakouts.

[brave777]

How To Prevent The Spread Of The Virals - James Freeman Fake News
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HC8DcBOpEuY

[BallzDeep9]

Couple of good COVID-19 resources for anyone who wants Current News and science:

Michael Osterholm frequently appears on CNN, Univ Minnesota, Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy. He does a monthly Podcast here:

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/covid-19/podcasts-webinars

Also Reddit - Current News and real science discussion of COVID.

https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/

[StringThing]

I quit my job because someone got COVID-19 and they were not doing anything about it. I can't really risk it with my situation.

Mask up people!

[Jestrice2002]

I quit my job because someone got COVID-19 and they were not doing anything about it. I can't really risk it with my situation.

Mask up people!

That's insane. That's like screwing you over twice! I'm sorry you've had to deal with that.

[WhiteAngelica]

You know, a second stimulus check would be fabulous for staving off evictions.

[brave777]

You know, a second stimulus check would be fabulous for staving off evictions.

September is the rumor but we to await and see what happens.

Now walmart losing business and now they want all the people who dont wear masks, mann they flip flop so much. I also noticed once a covid positive person on job site and companys lose few people right away who dont want to risk catching something. Others leave because doctor told them to stay in nature and get lots of oxygen to be healthy while jobs forcing to cover nose, health is more important to some so there is no reason to be working with that rule in force so company's everywhere losre more numbers!. Not to mention all those who had masks on having lungs issues and end up in hospital, that more numbers fropping off companys. Now most jobs cooling down on the pressure with masks since even the big companys in short of people right now and it cost more money to train and hire they rather loosen the restriction or not care if people wear it or not. Saving a company is bigger things on the list it seems. Or like wallmart gaining or keeping customers is priority over safety. I am still surprised that some of you think perhaps a mask will protect you?????? are you serious? its been proven thousand times it has 2% protecting you. Even women's leggings will do a better job as a mask. Shit is real, once people admit, it all leans on survival and you need money to survive, safety catching something goes out the window. Got no money, you will most likely end up under the bridge faster then you think then sitting home scared. While riots popping up all over the place and it seems day by day millitia is growing in strengths to defends their own sub divisions locally everywhere. Police or state no way will risk their life so you are left alone, will you join one localy? or you get rioted and goods stolen? Nope your one shotgun wont save you. I feel very bad and sadens me to see this is happening. welcome to reality people, more shit to come....

[INSENSE3]

I’m thinking on a smaller scale right now. All of this lipsticks and chapsticks and lip liners, lip gloss companies don’t likely stand a chance. Who uses such products NOW? My favorite glosses have hardly been touched because they are not practical beneath a mask. Sticky gloss, especially. Wal Mart probably won’t be stocking those..there are umbrellas, chairs and big coolers for parties sitting on shelves alongside yard decor for worthless summer enjoyment, the list goes on and on. Unemployment will continue to expand...well beyond food industry. Nobody will be able to afford the food delivery for long...

Hopefully some creative changes will be able to replace the millions of businesses not yet being hit..

And you touched on an ugly truth, brave777. Covid Discrimination. Nobody talks about it, but it’s very much becoming a problem. Already. Make room for covid survivors being completely abandoned by society. Hope I’m wrong!

This virus has already demonstrated how much we haven’t learned from historical past mistakes.

Good seeing a post from you, brave777. Hp

[BallzDeep9]

You know, a second stimulus check would be fabulous for staving off evictions.

Good News, the $1200 stim check is a done deal... They are debating "other stuff" but Repugs say they'll have it out tomorrow, Monday 7/27?

Funny Trump WAS insisting on a Payroll Tax Cut = in other words, "Destroying Social Security" , before everyone told him to sit down

https://fox59.com/news/coronavirus/next ... l-tax-cut/

[herbalhippie]

Of course he was.

[TheNihilist™]

Everyone must have forgot the last payroll tax cut was made in 2011 by the Obama administration. I don't remember there being a pandemic in 2011. We need incentives for people to go back to work when they have the opportunity, not stay home and collect more in unemployment then they made working. I don't know, maybe they would have less time to assault people and burn shit down. Obamas payroll tax cuts were good, but Trumps are bad. Just another example of the Demorats double standard.

[MikeEdoessomething]

Everyone must have forgot the last payroll tax cut was made in 2011 by the Obama administration. I don't remember there being a pandemic in 2011. We need incentives for people to go back to work when they have the opportunity, not stay home and collect more in unemployment then they made working. I don't know, maybe they would have less time to assault people and burn shit down. Obamas payroll tax cuts were good, but Trumps are bad. Just another example of the Demorats double standard.

Not trying to get into politics, but about the unemployment, that's not exactly how it works. If you are offered you job back, and you refuse to return, you lose ALL your benefits (unless you have very limited set of factors that you meet to remain eligible, which varies state to state I believe). There are also cases where employees can refuse to return to work if they can argue that it is not safe to be at work or their employer is not following proper guidelines, but this is not something that is easy to achieve (good luck even speaking to a person from unemployment). I take care of my parents who are both very high risk, and I had to make a choice: Return and lose benefits or stay home and lose benefits. Lucky for me, since I have been working for The Cheesecake Factory for 15 years as a server, they worked with my schedule where I was only work limited part time (to reduce risk of exposure) and still collect partial unemployment. The 600$ extra benefits is done now, and I only get $137 a week on regular unemployment.

Now there may be people who are choosing to stay home, instead of working, and still getting all their benefits plus the extra $600 weekly, but that is either their employer allowing them to do so or a mistake in the system. Many people will have to return the money they are collecting (unemployment can ask for money they gave you to be returned). It could be that the system in states is so overwhelmed that people are still collecting money when they shouldn't. This extra money is also going to be taxed and we'll be repaying some of it next year's taxes. But unless you're job allows you to stay home and stay on unemployment, if you refuse to return to work you lose benefits

But I wanted to point out that you can't just willingly refuse to return to work and stay home and collect benefits (unless your employer gives that option, which some have, my employer gave employees till June 30th to return when the store re-opened on June 11th). And this differs state to state also... My workplace is at 50% capacity, and will stay that way for the rest of the year most likely. Not everyone is being rehired. And this is a similar thing happening all across the county in many business sectors. Not to mention, the unemployment plus bonus $600 is still a lose of income for many. And this extra money is the only thing helping the economy at the moment. Take this money away, and there is going to be a housing/rent crises, evictions of potentially millions, and families starving unable to pay bills. Many people want to return to work, but there are not jobs hiring (outside of Walmart/Amazon/food stores). And many others have risk factors for staying home. I almost did not return to work because of my high risk parents. America didn't have a real lock down... we could have done what most countries in Europe did and been moving on with our lives. But we never contained the spread of covid. Here in North Carolina the cases have continued to increase all along. The protests going on now are child's play to what will happen in millions of people lose their benefits and start getting evicted/unable to feed family.

https://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/as-st ... use-61344/
Quote from above link: "Generally, a refusal to work disqualifies an individual from unemployment benefits. But in the current COVID-19 pandemic, many states have relaxed the criteria to allow for continued benefits when the refusal to work is because of a personal situation exacerbated by COVID-19."

[herbalhippie]

If you're called back to work and refuse to go and unemployment finds out, you're in deep shit. I know of someone who did this and was reported.

[MikeEdoessomething]

If you're called back to work and refuse to go and unemployment finds out, you're in deep shit. I know of someone who did this and was reported.

Exactly. That is why the narrative that people are just sitting on the couch refusing to work and collecting all this money is so frustrating. It's not that simple. Sure some people are doing just that and sure some will get away with it, but like you said, if you get reported states take unemployment fraud very seriously. A lot of people will end up having to repay money they collected when they were no longer eligible.

I know my job gave a hard cut off date: You either return by that date, or you lose your job and your unemployment benefits. A lot of my co-workers are working part time and collecting partial unemployment, but that is because the company is allowing it and we are still only half staffed. Without the extra $600 a lot of us will be seriously screwed. Tips are terrible right now! My restaurant closes a few hours earlier than we used to, and between that and reduced seating, I am making HALF of what I normally would/used to make on my shifts.

[TheNihilist™]

If you're called back to work and refuse to go and unemployment finds out, you're in deep shit. I know of someone who did this and was reported.

Exactly. That is why the narrative that people are just sitting on the couch refusing to work and collecting all this money is so frustrating. It's not that simple. Sure some people are doing just that and sure some will get away with it, but like you said, if you get reported states take unemployment fraud very seriously. A lot of people will end up having to repay money they collected when they were no longer eligible.

I know my job gave a hard cut off date: You either return by that date, or you lose your job and your unemployment benefits. A lot of my co-workers are working part time and collecting partial unemployment, but that is because the company is allowing it and we are still only half staffed. Without the extra $600 a lot of us will be seriously screwed. Tips are terrible right now! My restaurant closes a few hours earlier than we used to, and between that and reduced seating, I am making HALF of what I normally would/used to make on my shifts.

To be fair nobody should be getting $600 extra a week. Everybody gets the $1200 and that's it. Some people never stopped working and don't even bring home what those on unemployment get. We're paying domestic terrorists $600 a week to do millions of dollars in damage to cities and burn down people's places of employment.

Joe Bidens so scared he won't come out of his basement. Best place for him, he can't put two sentences in a row without sounding like an Alzheimers patient. He literally said "Hi, I'm Joe Biden's wife, Joe Biden". He screwed up a PRE-RECORDED message. I can't wait until he's forced to come out and debate Trump. In the meantime everybody can collect their $600 a week while screaming "Orange man bad!"

[herbalhippie]

NO MORE POLITICAL POSTS

[TheNihilist™]

NO MORE POLITICAL POSTS

Thank you! Now I won't have to see people bashing Republicans and the POTUS and feel the need to respond.

[acejestyr15]

NO MORE POLITICAL POSTS

I tried putting and end to the political nonsense a month or two ago and got shutdown....

[Greyfeather]

@MikeEdoessomething.

Great post Mike! I always enjoy your work
Thanks for updating us about your sich. You have taken on a lot of responsibilities, and I'm sure that your parents are proud of you. Having read articles about customers returning to indoor dining, I find it alarming that customers are being described as 'rude', 'demanding', 'impatient' (although they seem to be tipping well). Are your customers behaving themselves?

And I'm wondering: if this whole pandemic were a novel that you were writing, how would you end it? Or maybe I should ask, how do you see it ending?

[brave777]

I can't wait until he's (biden) forced to come out and debate Trump.

That wont happen. ReaL BIDEN is for good out of the picture. His copy has a shorter ear and wrinkled forehead. You can pull the pictures from google and you can see the difference miles away. The old bidden and the new one. i know its political but i just had to correct it.

[Quercus]

It looks like the shit may really hit the fan between eviction moratoriums and extra unemployment payments ending. I know this has the potential to really hurt some people on this forum, including some who have posted in this thread. If any of you find yourselves low on kratom without a way to replenish your supply, please send me a DM. I might be able to help out.

[BallzDeep9]

Obamas payroll tax cuts were good, but Trumps are bad.

That's called a False Equivalency. Fact: Trump demanded a Payroll Tax Cut. (The Repuglicans would destroy Social Security.) "But so did Obama!!"

I mean... Bull Shit. Come on, nobody believes President Liar - or his Radical Racist Religious Right.

Fake facts!! What aboutism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism
Whataboutism is particularly associated with Soviet and Russian propaganda. ... When criticized or asked to defend his behavior, Trump has frequently changed the subject by criticizing Hillary Clinton, the Obama Administration, and the Affordable Care Act... When asked about Russian human rights violations, Trump has shifted focus to the US itself .. employing whataboutism tactics similar to those used by Russian President Vladimir Putin.

[BallzDeep9]

It looks like the shit may really hit the fan between eviction moratoriums and extra unemployment payments ending.

well Congress takes vacation after August 7 So of course, they're delaying the Stimulus package, until the last minute.. As usual. I'd still expect they will reach agreement, during this coming week. $1200 Stim check for everyone... Let's hope they include Post Office relief ? Dems hold the cards!

[herbalhippie]

Ballz, stop. Ok we all got our political opinions aired. That's enough.

[herbalhippie]

It looks like the shit may really hit the fan between eviction moratoriums and extra unemployment payments ending.

well Congress takes vacation after August 7 So of course, they're delaying the Stimulus package, until the last minute.. As usual. I'd still expect they will reach agreement, during this coming week. $1200 Stim check for everyone... Let's hope they include Post Office relief ? Dems hold the cards!

Congress has put their recess on hold until the package is figured out.

[INSENSE3]

Thank you all for very entertaining and educational posts! Y’all are much more fun to learn more about stuff I’m sort of ignoring to manage my PTSD. Stuff hits a nerve and then I shut down and I can’t shut down. Like MikeEdoessomething, I’m keeping mom’s life in order. She and I are both immune compromised. I’ve kept her so removed from the situation that she forgets about wearing a mask n stuff when people stop by. She’s informed by following the news like crazy, but her actual life is minimally changed. We are already isolators. I have done all errands (as I did before) besides walking her shih tzu.

MikeEdoessomething, thanks for the status from out “in the field”. Herbalhippie and BallzDeep9, y’all crack me up. I appreciate the humor being included for no extra charge.

Hopefully everyone on the forum is well, safe and accounted for. Hopefully y’all have a few hugs in your germ circle.

Thank you,

Laurie
INSENSE3

[herbalhippie]

I've had exactly 2 hugs in the last 4 or 5 months. It's not enough.

My son and I are still isolating. It suits us fine, we're both very reclusive. I've gotten used to not popping out to the store more than a couple times a week.

Went to Costco today, I meant to go during senior's hour but forgot. Got there about 10:15 and there was a line! I thought that was over and done with. I did get a pack of toilet paper, so there's that.

I can't believe how many holes there are in stock in the stores still. The latest thing was vinegars, then soy sauces. At Fred Meyer (Kroger) anyway.

[Quercus]

I've had exactly 2 hugs in the last 4 or 5 months. It's not enough.

My son and I are still isolating. It suits us fine, we're both very reclusive. I've gotten used to not popping out to the store more than a couple times a week.

Went to Costco today, I meant to go during senior's hour but forgot. Got there about 10:15 and there was a line! I thought that was over and done with. I did get a pack of toilet paper, so there's that.

I can't believe how many holes there are in stock in the stores still. The latest thing was vinegars, then soy sauces. At Fred Meyer (Kroger) anyway.

I've been able to get toilet paper and vinegar but for some reason Tilex Daily Shower Cleaner is a no-show everywhere I look! Amazon had a case of the refills available so I broke down and ordered it. It was headed my way but seems to have vanished and is no longer available. So, crap. I have to clean my shower the old fashioned way.

[herbalhippie]

The cleaning products shelves are still mostly empty. I am surprised when I see anything with bleach in it, like Tilex. Or the Clorox cleaning spray with bleach that I use once in a while.

Well, at least if there's ever another panic buy, I won't have to join in.

eta: I just realized that's a lie, I panic bought just last night.

Normally I buy a years supply of ingredients for my pain balm once a year in early January or so. It's big orders and a lot of money.

I was going to get some more Topo Chico mineral water from Walmart yesterday and looked online to see if was in stock. Nope. Not in the store, not available to be shipped. Looked around online, there's a shortage. It's not being exported at this time. Well, ok, I'll just hoard what I have left (about 30 bottles).

Last night I started thinking about my herbal ingredients. Most of them are a US product I think, but some aren't. Maybe I'd better look into it. I started making an order with Mountain Rose and when I got to the menthol crystals I about s*** myself. The bag of menthol crystals I spent $180 in January is now $350. They come from India.

I ended up ordering everything I needed for a year last night, including some dried herbs I won't be needing for a while yet but I had to get those. Arnica flowers often go out of stock even when there's not a pandemic going on. And they come from Canada. Beeswax pastilles were out of stock for like at least 6 months last year.

I was able to get everything I need and now I'm good for another year and a half.

[INSENSE3]

Panic buying here, too. Trying to shop local instead of online, but these long lines SUCK and my panicked brain won’t do it. If I were to use a more relaxing red, I might be able to, but I’m a recluse, so I risk the “just stay home n chill” option. I have ALWAYS hated trying to park and shop at our Trader Joe’s and now with the 20-30 minute wait outside...I had to at least PEEK at Amazon. Yup, I took my orders there. They even accept my EBT FOOD benefits! Never knew that! Holy moly, that was cool.
We are low on overstock TP again, so I’m going to try for more later today or tomorrow. I had ordered some from China (on Amazon) last March and I cancelled the order back in May, but it came anyway, 2 weeks ago! These little rolls look smaller in person than what the website photo was. Definitely misrepresented. However, I took these tiny rolls over to my boyfriend’s tiny mobile home and they pack a punch! I would buy them again! They are better than what we use, but the roll is smaller. But it still fits a roll dispenser. I feel bad for having complained and canceling. Stuff is just NOT always as it appears! I know that. I was in such a bad mood and took it out on the Chinese. Not cool. There’s too much of THAT going on already
So ashamed... Back to store shelves and phenomenon stock missing...my mom started YELLING AT ME when I told her there was no Tostitos salsa (she knows I’m not a motivated shopper because I don’t like that stuff AT ALL). My boyfriend also said I was obviously just having a bad day because I could not find his tapatio, either! Even the store clerk said to “look in the ‘Mexican’ aisle”. Those ethnic separations in stores bother me, so anyway, “I did! You mean the ‘Asian’ aisle, right?” He said, just look down aisle 7. So I forgot mom’s ice cream and needed to pee. So I was allowed to use their bathroom (WOW-that was off limits in March!) and I went ahead and looked down aisle 7 AGAIN. Neither product but no blatant holes on the shelves. Mysterious.. I finally found some of the hideous salsa on the chip aisle. Got the ice cream and the boyfriend got his tapatio elsewhere.

I’m in 12 step meetings and now they are on zoom or in parks and parking lots. Been to a gazillion meetings discussing these new formats and how to stay within guidelines. Lots of people are “uncomfortable with” this and that, including me. But being uncomfortable about being on zoom is confusing to me. Seems all of us recovering addicts do not like discomfort! Hahaha That has been interesting! Like MikeEdoessomething, I’ve got mom to think of here and my own compromised immune system. I’m staying online for a while still, even tho I prefer the in-person meetings.

Hugs are a rarity, herbalhippie. I’ll be missing THOSE the most into infinity ♾ apparently,

Hugs

Thanks for the therapeutic shares...

Laurie
INSENSE3

[herbalhippie]

My youngest daughter who lives at her dad's with him and her stepmom just called me. He got taken to the hospital by ambulance about a half hour ago. Oxygen level VERY low, he was 'loopy' she says. He fought going, she had to beg him to get in the ambulance.

This man REFUSED to wear a mask. He laughed at coronavirus. It's a hoax. There's no pandemic. He'd going shopping all over town like he does, get to the door of Costco, tell them he had a medical exemption and waltz right in. He's a rabid right-winger. Patriot type.

I guess he was sick for a few days. Refused to go to the doctor. Refused to get tested.

I'm pretty upset but mostly I AM FUCKING PISSED OFF. All he had to do was put a mask on his face for a half hour a couple times a day. Use hand sanitizer when he couldn't wash his hands.

edit: Hospital called my daughter. He's doing better on oxygen but they're putting him in the ICU in case they have to intubate him. He's A&O x4, so that's good. Covid positive. He can have NO visitors. I had to talk my other two daughters into not coming, there's no where safe for them to stay and as he can't have visitors.

Son and I are getting tested tomorrow. We don't hang out with family, haven't for months. But Dad brought me over an old classic sci-fi book 4 or 5 days ago and we chatted (at a distance) on my porch. left the book on the porch until yesterday and it's been very hot. I knew I should have Lysoled it.

Here's another thing pissed me right off. His wife was sick and tested positive TWO WEEKS ago and they didn't tell anyone.

[brave777]

Hh, testing positive, these days people aim for to get that 14 day pay stay home deal. Well thats how i start to feel about. This girl co-worker randomly decided to test herself for covid, and WHAAATTT sAYYY whhhaat??? BOOM! Positive...... Then she spams all over facebook she is covid positive. It automatic stay home 14 days here, not sure other states. after 14 days like nothing happened been working with us. No one is worried. If she never went to get tested no one would even know she were positive to begin with. And HH if you still didnt know covid never was isolated. The sticks they use is to catch any type of flu like symptoms and many times they false positive, you test again your negative. or shall i say positive? wait its negative!? Imagine how many have to be in isolation stay home orders because of that? A LOT!If your sick and and ill by all means stay home but if your not sick or ill, there is no reason you should be 14 days stay home.

I'm not going to remove this but I am going to note that if you even THINK you've been closely exposed, get tested and ISOLATE.