7oh smaller doses

[Kelleytoons]

So today I thought I'd write about something interesting to me (and folks who "hate" 7oh can just ignore).

As a rule my dose of 7oh is around 7mg (which ends up being a quarter of a 30mg tablet from my favorite vendor). This gives me the same effects as around 3 grams of kratom, albeit it MUCH better, more consistent (every single time) and longer effects (and obviously MUCH easier to consume, being 1/100 as small). I had experimented prior to my surgery of taking a stronger tablet, 50mg, and grinding it up and then putting about 20 grams of kratom mixed in, and stuffing the mixture into my normal self-made capsules (these capsules hold around .5 of a gram of kratom but in this case I only half filled them).

In essence this was about .25 gram of kratom (I used some samples I have from various vendors to make up the 25 grams) and only a VERY small dose of 7oh (perhaps 1mg). As a control, I also stuffed some of the capsules with ONLY the kratom.

In testing these out taking a single kratom capsule does nothing, which isn't surprising considering we're talking about .25 a gram of kratom. Even very good stuff never works for me at such a low dose. However - the ones with only the micro dose of 7oh? Best kratom I've EVER had.

Which opens up some very interesting possibilities. It's more work to set these capsules up, but it means that my cost per dose of the 7oh is now much lower - about 20 cents (whereas when I just use the 7oh capsules it costs around $1 per dose). It's a lot more work, but so far it's VERY consistent (I've been using these each morning for a few weeks and, again, best kratom ever). At only one capsule to swallow, it certainly makes my morning dose about the easiest it could ever be (plus easy to carry with me).

[Bandit357]

yes I take 1/4 0f a 20mg tablet with 1.5 g of kratom and get very long lasting effects 6hrs
Ive tried half a tab 10mg and was too much for me. small amounts is the key to using 7oh

[BallzDeep9]

Yes absolutely, "Less is More" with Kratom, and.... 7OH IS = Kratom. - because it's made FROM kratom. (Not "synthetic")

Reasonable to expect, 7-Hydroxy extract will have the same properties - as Raw Kratom Leaf - Same ceiling effect. And so, Same Tolerance issues when going OVER the ceiling, and... here's one to consider... Reverse Tolerance - when staying UNDER ... A ceiling of Low "Recommended Serving" Yes. Article LINK

We increase SENSITIVITY - to the substance - by taking LESS. We become "Less Sensitive" when abusing large amounts. It's like... MORE begets a need for "More". But all we hear about Kratom, and 7OH, is the problem of Tolerance... And it's always the people doing MORE and more... who experience Tolerance!! - Which is unfortunately, the majority of Kratom users... since Raw "Plain Leaf" is only 3% alkaloids - vendors have always pushed, taking More (and of course, buying More!) - and so, we've got lots of people, complaining about negative Side Effects - from doing HUGE amounts - 20, 30, 50 grams per Day. See the "Quitting" groups on Reddit... LOL

Interesting ARTICLE / Science Paper / What Is Reverse Tolerance? Understanding Sensitization

[Kelleytoons]

Hmmm, not sure I like that "reverse tolerance" article's implications.

So if I take TOO LITTLE 7oh I may be screwing myself up? I wonder, now, what the actual dosage should be.

So far I haven't been combing it with kratom powder - just the 1/4 7oh tablet for each dose. I wonder if:

1) I should definitely be combing it and/or
2) I should make sure I take perhaps a bit more than 1/4 a tablet

The reason I mention this is that 1/4 tablet of even the 30mg one is VERY tiny - it's not much bigger than the head of a pin (note - the kind of pins my grandmother sewed with, that have a kind of bulb on the end. Not the flat head pins but still pretty damn tiny). I'm trying to get around 7mg each dose.

I also thought I might buy some raw powder and try partitioning it out in capsules. I have to think about this some more.

[KratomSavesLives24/7]

This is not kratom. Find your own group for people who want to get kratom banned because they want to take 7oh pills that resemble prescription pain killers. This crap will get kratom banned. I think i speak for the kratom community when i say you people make me sick. Get off double m with this crap. It’s not kratom.

[Jking]

7oh is a great substance with so much potential. It’s very benign. It might not be kratom but it’s still an alkaloid of it. It can help so many people who are in pain, or addicted to something worse. Smaller doses are the way to go. I’ve found taking large doses just messes up your tolerance plus not mentioning you might waste a lot because of the ceiling effect. Your receptors have to reset. The longer you can go between doses the better. I’ve found that tolerance is not an issue if you are smart about your usage.

[Kelleytoons]

Actually it IS kratom. Those saying it is not are ignorant (but I deal with a LOT of ignorant folks and mostly just ignore them).

It's an EXTRACT and as such it is focused on certain aspects of kratom.

[Adrumaddict]

Codeine is an alkaloid that is usually derived from morphine (or opium), but it is certainly not considered morphine and for good reason. Morphine is considerably stronger and has a much higher potential for abuse.

7oh is an alkaloid that is derived from kratom but it is certainly not considered kratom and for good reason. 7oh is considerably stronger and has a much higher potential for abuse.

It’s wild to me that people are trying to convince others that 7oh is kratom. Once the rehab facilities report an influx of 7oh cases and soccer moms start calling their representatives complaining how their child had to drop out of college because of an acute 7oh addiction it will be over for 7oh. I wish it wasn’t this way, I believe people should have the right to ingest whatever substance they desire as long as it’s not harming anyone else, but that’s not the reality of the system we reside in.

Once lawmakers start banning 7oh do you really want them so convinced that it is kratom, or would you rather they made the distinction so they don’t just ban the entire plant? Also, if the FDA does an 8-factor analysis on 7oh it will again be over for 7oh because of the extremely high abuse potential.

I beg some of you to please rethink what you’re advocating for and if it’s really worth potentially losing it all.

[Kelleytoons]

Again, I will ignore this ignorance.

[Adrumaddict]

Again, I will ignore this ignorance.

Enlighten me Kelley, which part of my post was incorrect and why? I'm not being argumentative or sarcastic either, I genuinely want to know where I'm wrong so I can learn.

[anonk]

Can't wait for these people to show up to there town ban hearings to convince the law makers that 7-oh IS kratom because I guarantee Louisiana banning kratom isn't an anomaly your state or town is coming soon.

[BallzDeep9]

7oh is an alkaloid that is derived from kratom but it is certainly not considered kratom and for good reason. 7oh is considerably stronger and has a much higher potential for abuse.

It’s wild to me that people are trying to convince others that ... 7oh is Kratom.

Get the Facts (sigh)... Follow the Science... Seek the Truth! 7-Hydroxy - is a naturally occurring alkaloid, found in the Kratom plant (Mitragyna speciosa), ... It is one of the most potent active compounds in kratom and is known for its strong analgesic and euphoric effects... PHOTO below, is a T-Shirt you can buy from Simply 7OH website. This whole "7OH is not Kratom" thing - is becoming a Joke !!

The stupid looking dude wearing AKA Hat and "protesting" 7OH - on the T-shirt - Photo is from, one of several - PAID "protests", sponsored by a Rival Vendor "Feel Free", who sells an adulterated Kratom Product - it's MIT alkaloids combo with Kava - This California millionaire, (JW Ross, who is also the founder of Botanic Tonics) is sponsoring ANTI- 7OH legislation in many states. He started a non-profit, "Global Kratom Coalition" aka GKC - which competes with AKA - and includes some Big Kratom vendors like MIT-45 and OPMS. IF any product is "Not Kratom"... it's the Feel Free shots.

NOTE - I WAITED almost 1 year, and was skeptical when 7OH was first announced... that was 2 Years ago! But over the past YEAR - The huge selection of Kratom products has NOW finally, evolved and expanded... to where many, many, fine Extracts are available! - And of course it's Retail - $ Money, that drives this innovation (IN our Capitalist system, isn't it always "The Money" ??) QUOTE "Necessity is the Mother of Invention"



Today I received, several Retail products by mail - This is from Ultra Seven "7-OH Chewable Tablets", you get 10 "Low Dose" tablets only 7mg EACH - in a neat little dispenser looks like a lipstick tube! So for Kelley - smaller doses? These are great. 7mg per 1 tablet, cut 'em in half you get 3.5 mg 7OH. Just 1 example... of the booming 7OH market! - COST = $15 for the tube of 10 = BOGO deal from Pure Leaf, cuts price to $7... for 10 tabs. That's .70 cents EACH. https://ultra7kratom.com/

[Adrumaddict]

"7-Hydroxy - is a naturally occurring alkaloid" I feel like this deserves a, "no shit" response lol. Seriously though Balz, codeine is a natural occurring alkaloid in the Poppy plant, so what's your point? I never said 7oh wasn't a natural occurring alkaloid in kratom. Maybe read my post again, then reply?

[BallzDeep9]

Drum Addict - aww c'mon, I post here for The general Public, to read - Please "Nuthin' Personal" You and I have been hanging out here on MM for, what... years! and I appreciate your input here & as usual... thought provoking and interesting. But I MUST take issue with "Certainly Not considered Kratom"... I mean, you say TomaToe, I say toMahtoe, One word Label... isn't enough to cover ALL that "Kratom" has become, and IS now... A Life saving, amazing, thing ~ in ALL its many many forms.

[dimmitree]

"7-Hydroxy - is a naturally occurring alkaloid" I feel like this deserves a, "no shit" response lol. Seriously though Balz, codeine is a natural occurring alkaloid in the Poppy plant, so what's your point? I never said 7oh wasn't a natural occurring alkaloid in kratom. Maybe read my post again, then reply?

A portion of mitragynine is converted to 7-oh on first pass when taken orally anyways. 7-oh is an active metabolite of mitragynine. This has been known for a few years now.

I'm honestly not a big fan of pure 7-oh. I bought about a gram of 7-oh extract and have been toying around with small doses. I'd rather just take 3g of plain leaf or some full spectrum over 5-10mg of 85% 7-oh extract. Maybe I'm not taking as much as I think I am, but my .001 scale is reading it as 10mg and I find it a weak and boring buzz. I only take 3-6g of plain leaf kratom max in a day, too, so I don't even have a tolerance. I was expecting better based on all the fear mongering.

I'd imagine people looking for a recreational high would get way more out of those high dose mitragynine extract shots than 7-oh tablets, but I don't really fuck around with those.

[Adrumaddict]

Drum Addict - aww c'mon, I post here for The general Public, to read - Please "Nuthin' Personal" You and I have been hanging out here on MM for, what... years! and I appreciate your input here & as usual... thought provoking and interesting. But I MUST take issue with "Certainly Not considered Kratom"... I mean, you say TomaToe, I say toMahtoe, One word Label... isn't enough to cover ALL that "Kratom" has become, and IS now... A Life saving, amazing, thing ~ in ALL its many many forms.

Of course Ballz, and it was never my intention to come across as nasty to you, that reply was meant to be taken lightly. It doesn't seem like my points are being addressed though so I'll try it a different way.

Is codeine opium? No. Why? Because pharmacology makes the distinction between the two due to the very different level of impact such as potency and abuse potential. They both come from the poppy plant though and like 7oh codeine is a natural occurring alkaloid.

7oh is a natural occurring alkaloid in kratom, when extracted and amplified why wouldn't pharmacology make the distinction between extracted 7oh and kratom? What is the difference between making the distinction between codeine and opium and kratom and 7oh? This is why I'm saying that 7oh is not kratom. Plus you can never ingest enough kratom leaf to even get close to the same effects as the extract without inducing vomiting, so science must make the distinction. Just because codeine comes from opium we don't call it opium we call it codeine.

To briefly summarize: Codeine comes from opium which is processed from the poppy plant, 7oh comes from kratom which is processed from the leaves of the kratom tree. If science makes the distinction between codeine and opium, it would also make the distinction between kratom and extracted 7oh.

I'm also curious what everyone thinks concerning lawmakers making the distinction between 7oh and kratom. If they start banning 7oh wouldn't we want them to make that distinction so they don't ban kratom along with it?

[Jking]

Well South Carolina is safe they passed laws, or whatever saying 7oh is safe as long it is labeled, and not sold to minors. Always been disappointed that sc never legalized weed but this gives me hope. The fact is it is not kratom it comes from kratom. Just like heroin comes from poppy. The difference is 7oh is a safe substance that has potential to enhance, and enrich lives. Don’t know why everyone is getting so heated over something so simple. No need to get salty about it. It important to make the distinction between the two so I agree with that otherwise what’s the point. Going around saying it is kratom is going to make people think it’s the same when’s it not.

[Kelleytoons]

Well South Carolina is safe they passed laws, or whatever saying 7oh is safe as long it is labeled, and not sold to minors. Always been disappointed that sc never legalized weed but this gives me hope. The fact is it is not kratom it comes from kratom. Just like heroin comes from poppy. The difference is 7oh is a safe substance that has potential to enhance, and enrich lives. Don’t know why everyone is getting so heated over something so simple. No need to get salty about it. It important to make the distinction between the two so I agree with that otherwise what’s the point. Going around saying it is kratom is going to make people think it’s the same when’s it not.

This.

(Plus I find it VERY amusing that folks get so hot about something others have taken that helps them with the quality of their lives when THEY THEMSELVES are doing exactly the same thing. Okay, I get it, you are worried that one thing may cause your other to be curtailed, but if you were a NICE person you'd be happy for others and want for them the same thing you want for yourself. If you do not - this is known as hypocrisy which is why I won't even bother to engage with those idiots. Either you want the same for me as for thee, or you are a lying hypocrite who doesn't deserve my time).

BTW, I got ANOTHER person (suffering from extreme pain for decades now with NOTHING - not even kratom - helping) using 7oh and their life has changed dramatically so they are finally able to leave their home. After decades. If that doesn't make you feel great, then just SFTU.

[IndelibleDotInk]

7oh is a great substance with so much potential. It’s very benign. It might not be kratom but it’s still an alkaloid of it. It can help so many people who are in pain, or addicted to something worse. Smaller doses are the way to go. I’ve found taking large doses just messes up your tolerance plus not mentioning you might waste a lot because of the ceiling effect. Your receptors have to reset. The longer you can go between doses the better. I’ve found that tolerance is not an issue if you are smart about your usage.

I agree, except that I don't think it's totally benign. IMO it's as strong as oxycodone and has a high abuse potential, attracting the druggie type. I'm just getting my opinion out there, I don't have a solution or remedy. I've tried it a few times and some of those times resulted in what were basically hangovers the next day, but the actual experience was enjoyable, and very strong, but I'd rather stick to plain leaf.

[Loveandpeace]

So today I thought I'd write about something interesting to me (and folks who "hate" 7oh can just ignore).

As a rule my dose of 7oh is around 7mg (which ends up being a quarter of a 30mg tablet from my favorite vendor). This gives me the same effects as around 3 grams of kratom, albeit it MUCH better, more consistent (every single time) and longer effects (and obviously MUCH easier to consume, being 1/100 as small). I had experimented prior to my surgery of taking a stronger tablet, 50mg, and grinding it up and then putting about 20 grams of kratom mixed in, and stuffing the mixture into my normal self-made capsules (these capsules hold around .5 of a gram of kratom but in this case I only half filled them).

In essence this was about .25 gram of kratom (I used some samples I have from various vendors to make up the 25 grams) and only a VERY small dose of 7oh (perhaps 1mg). As a control, I also stuffed some of the capsules with ONLY the kratom.

In testing these out taking a single kratom capsule does nothing, which isn't surprising considering we're talking about .25 a gram of kratom. Even very good stuff never works for me at such a low dose. However - the ones with only the micro dose of 7oh? Best kratom I've EVER had.

Which opens up some very interesting possibilities. It's more work to set these capsules up, but it means that my cost per dose of the 7oh is now much lower - about 20 cents (whereas when I just use the 7oh capsules it costs around $1 per dose). It's a lot more work, but so f....

Hey kelly,
Who are you getting your 7OH from? I have a trip to Italy this summer and could use the economics of it all.

Thanks

[Kelleytoons]

https://omegaextrax.com/

Note that they run out of stuff ALL the time - but then get restocked (you can also email them and they are VERY good at getting back and letting you know the status of restock).

They JUST came back in stock with 30mg Strawberry (my fav - I quarter this and it is absolutely the BEST).

[Loveandpeace]

Thanks old friend,

I bought the 5 pack of strawberry. I am going for subtle w the least amount of tolerance increase. I have been a reg flower beast. Protip: when running low, make arrangements ASAP. I ended up going through my heavy hitters and am now at the dregs and it eroded my dosing. All my fault but with a Europe trip coming up, I should have planned better.

[BallzDeep9]

Thanks old friend, I bought the 5 pack of strawberry...

Please read carefully what Kelley is saying... these are TWICE as strong as "Regular" 7Oh tabs. So - Quarter tablet !! sublingual. Might take an hour ? for full FX depending on YOUR system.

[Kelleytoons]

Thanks old friend,

I bought the 5 pack of strawberry. I am going for subtle w the least amount of tolerance increase. I have been a reg flower beast. Protip: when running low, make arrangements ASAP. I ended up going through my heavy hitters and am now at the dregs and it eroded my dosing. All my fault but with a Europe trip coming up, I should have planned better.

Yes, as Mr. B reminds - ONLY A QUARTER OF A TAB. (Nice thing about the new Strawberry's is they come scored both ways, making it easy to get an exact quarter of a tablet with a good pill slicer).

The other thing I'm experimenting with (for very low doses) requires more effort if you're not already making your own capsules but let me point it out just in case you are or want to think about it in the future: I take their 50mg tablets and grind up two or three and then make up 100 capsules full of kratom and this mixed. It works out to around 1-2 grams per dose and seems to hit extra hard (most likely due to the mix of kratom in them).

You *can* by the raw powder (which I have also done) but the measurement of it is a bitch and trying to get such a low dose is almost impossible (I ended up taking the time to put 7 or so grams into EACH capsule but this took a LOT of hand work. Then I filled the rest with kratom. I've only take two of these capsules so far and the results are very hit or miss, most likely because the measurement of such small doses is VERY difficult. The first capsule I took was fine, but the second seemed to miss almost entirely, which is SO weird because I've never had that happen with 7oh. So I guess I just screwed up the measurement).