Thank God for 7oh extracts

[Silverstone]

I think that some of the disagreements made on this post concern semantics and differences in how people define things. In regards to 7-oh, Ballz said “Any product made FROM KRATOM is definitely a “Kratom” product.
Personally, I do not consider 7oh to be in the same category as kratom, and I think that if advocates of 7oh continue to say this, we are screwing ourselves. In order for the 7oh contained in the kratom plant to exert the effect that people like Kelleytoons are seeking, there needs to be chemical manipulation of the raw plant. It is like aspirin from the Willow Tree, or heroin from the Poppy Plant. Our lawmakers are essentially, in my opinion, getting the message that 7oh=kratom – so BAN IT ALL to keeps our kids safe. I don't want ANYTHING banned....so we, as a community, have to be smart about how to prevent this from happening.

Even if it is revolutionary for pain management, I think we need to use caution comparing it to the opiates that people are not using responsibly. Then also saying, 7oh = kratom. If the lawmakers seek to ban 7oh, they may also consider banning the SOURCE of the ‘raw’ material (ie. Leaf kratom).

Leaf kratom has added significant value to my life. Since 2016, it has allowed me to stay away from illegal substances and alcohol. I credit kratom with relieving my depression and anxiety so I can function as a productive member of society. I acknowledge that I have an ‘addiction’ to kratom, and caffeine as well…. But I can accept that. I think that people who are addicted to, or very much ‘enjoy’ a substance, will fight ‘tooth and nail’ to defend their addiction. I 100% agree with Kelleytoons that alcohol is by far the most dangerous substance, and that if people acted entirely rationally, alcohol would be illegal and things like weed and kratom wouldn’t even be considered for bans. Kratom powder doesn’t kill people. (In all the reported deaths (supposedly from kratom), there were OTHER substances present. But we ARE NOT DEALING with rational and logical arguments and people are people. People don’t want to ban alcohol because the people who make the laws enjoy it. Kratom is relatively new on the scene. Scott Gottlieb tried to ban it based on misinformation, or b/c the pharma companies didn’t want competition, etc… BUT NOW- things ARE different! 7oh is being marketed NOT to painful senior citizens, but to young people- and not for pain management.
I think it is VITALLY IMPORTANT that all of us who need/want to continue using ANY of the products mentioned in this forum, exercise EXTREME caution in how we talk about it. (Saying things like we “will beg on hands and knees” for 7oh is a scary statement.) I am very happy that you found a solution to your chronic pain, and that you share the benefits you have experienced with 7oh…but I would ask that you consider the audience, and take into account that we are being watched by people who are looking for legal ammunition. I don’t want anyone to be in pain, but I think there is a large % of people who are seeking a ‘different’ experience from it.

[Kelleytoons]

Okay, since you edited it so I can read it I will also edit my response.

It seems to me that your principle problem with 7oh is that it's being marketed to folks who might misuse it. And to that argument I'd say - so what? Again, alcohol is FAR more dangerous and marketed to even worse folks (folks who should NOT be drinking). Same with smoking (ANYTHING). So then you pivot and say, well, I agree but the folks who might ban those things use them so, no problem. And I'd say, that's such a hypocritical attitude to take you have no clue.

I've seen in others (and experienced myself) the benefits of 7oh and I know it's something that needs to be available and I will keep saying so and keep telling folks about it. And so will a lot of others who use it. If this does butthurt you you need to deal with that and not worry what others might or might not do with that information.

Here's something that might help you live a better life in general - do what you need to do for yourself and stop worrying about trying to control others. I PROMISE YOU this will serve you well the rest of your life. Trying to censor other folks or get them to do what you want AFTER they've expressed that they will not is not only useless, it shortens your life. Just start living and let others do the same and ALSO don't ask the government to do ANYTHING for you (that's another great piece of advice). You will live longer and happier and so will the others in your life who benefit from your presence.

[LeafersonJr32]

Okay, since you edited it so I can read it I will also edit my response.

It seems to me that your principle problem with 7oh is that it's being marketed to folks who might misuse it. And to that argument I'd say - so what? Again, alcohol is FAR more dangerous and marketed to even worse folks (folks who should NOT be drinking). Same with smoking (ANYTHING). So then you pivot and say, well, I agree but the folks who might ban those things use them so, no problem. And I'd say, that's such a hypocritical attitude to take you have no clue.

I've seen in others (and experienced myself) the benefits of 7oh and I know it's something that needs to be available and I will keep saying so and keep telling folks about it. And so will a lot of others who use it. If this does butthurt you you need to deal with that and not worry what others might or might not do with that information.

Here's something that might help you live a better life in general - do what you need to do for yourself and stop worrying about trying to control others. I PROMISE YOU this will serve you well the rest of your life. Trying to censor other folks or get them to do what you want AFTER they've expressed that they will not is not only useless, it shortens your life. Just start living and let others do the same and ALSO don't ask the government to do ANYTHING for you (that's another great piece of advice). You will live longer and happier and so will the others in your life who benefit from your presence.

I have to say it doesn't seem like you have any intent to even hear anyone else's opinion on the matter Mr.Toons. I definitely think the attitude that you have about this subject and going to such a defensive place when people point out that the way 7ohm is currently being marketed and it not clearly being differentiated from regular kratom that it could very well spell demise for both 7ohm and Kratom. May I ask why you are so dedicated to having to post your 7ohm talk on the kratom section of this forum? Are you totally opposed to being able to discuss 7ohm benefits and products with like minded people in a separate 7ohm section of the forum? I mean you can obviously see how many regular kratom users take issue with this and don't like coming here to see constant 7ohm talk and advertising so what keeps you so dedicated to wanting to post in the kratom forum?

[anonk]

I really feel like 7-oh is the end for kratom, with 3 state bans this year when January comes around you're going to see an absolute blood bath of bans. If we don't differentiate between plain leaf kratom and semi-synthetically produced 7-oh now law makers will simply ban it all which is what we are seeing now.

[Kelleytoons]

I have to say it doesn't seem like you have any intent to even hear anyone else's opinion on the matter Mr.Toons. I definitely think the attitude that you have about this subject and going to such a defensive place when people point out that the way 7ohm is currently being marketed and it not clearly being differentiated from regular kratom that it could very well spell demise for both 7ohm and Kratom. May I ask why you are so dedicated to having to post your 7ohm talk on the kratom section of this forum? Are you totally opposed to being able to discuss 7ohm benefits and products with like minded people in a separate 7ohm section of the forum? I mean you can obviously see how many regular kratom users take issue with this and don't like coming here to see constant 7ohm talk and advertising so what keeps you so dedicated to wanting to post in the kratom forum?

If you mean by what you wrote are you going to convince me 7oh is bad then the answer is, no, you won't convince me. I've head ALL these same things about kratom (and before that, grass). And I've heard the EXACT SAME arguments made, by folks like yourself who don't seem to ever want to see the other side of things. So you, too, are not able or willing to listen to other arguments.

Which is fine - we will convince neither one of us. But one thing I WILL not stand for is for folks like yourself to push lies and falsehoods because of your fear that something MIGHT happen to hurt you in some way. Particularly when I've seen how wonderful 7oh is. So I will continue to tell folks how great it is, and you can go ahead and make your own posts about how bad it is and, so what? Folks will make up their own mind.

Which is fine.

[BallzDeep9]

I really feel like 7-oh is the end for kratom, with 3 state bans this year when January comes around you're going to see an absolute blood bath of bans. If we don't differentiate between plain leaf kratom and semi-synthetically produced 7-oh now ....

Fear-mongering. The Kratom community has ALWAYS had Fear mongering - pretty much every single YEAR since I've known it, like 9 years. Every single year BOOM here comes another 'round of Fear. Sooo silly and predictable, everyone runs out and... Grab grab grab, Buy buy buy... the vendors laugh & people stockpile TONS of dirty powder... then, the Fear goes away !!

The #1 Reason WHY 7-Hydroxy will NOT be "banned" IS: 7-Hydroxy Saves Lives... period. We've had - 100,000 DEAD, per Year, from Fent overdoses, across USA ... and "Plain Dirt" kratom isn't doing SHIT - to prevent those deaths. Only 7Oh is strong enough for the "Doper Community" ... to NOT seek out street Fent and be satisfied taking 7OH. And after 2+ Years - nobody has overdosed on 7OH. - Bottom Line. Yes, 7OH (and Kratom), should be State Regulated.

[anonk]

I really feel like 7-oh is the end for kratom, with 3 state bans this year when January comes around you're going to see an absolute blood bath of bans. If we don't differentiate between plain leaf kratom and semi-synthetically produced 7-oh now ....

Fear-mongering. The Kratom community has ALWAYS had Fear mongering - pretty much every single YEAR since I've known it, like 9 years. Every single year BOOM here comes another 'round of Fear. Sooo silly and predictable, everyone runs out and... Grab grab grab, Buy buy buy... the vendors laugh & people stockpile TONS of dirty powder... then, the Fear goes away !!

The #1 Reason WHY 7-Hydroxy will NOT be "banned" IS: 7-Hydroxy Saves Lives... period. We've had - 100,000 DEAD, per Year, from Fent overdoses, across USA ... and "Plain Dirt" kratom isn't doing SHIT - to prevent those deaths. Only 7Oh is strong enough for the "Doper Community" ... to NOT seek out street Fent and be satisfied taking 7OH. And after 2+ Years - nobody has overdosed on 7OH. - Bottom Line. Yes, 7OH (and Kratom), should be State Regulated.

I'm going to bookmark this post just to prove how wrong you are about this come next year, I've been in the kratom community for almost 15 years now, this is different from the 2016 scare, this a coordinated effort across states to get kratom banned and it worked in 3 of them. Name a single lawmaker who supports 7-oh?

[Sityice]

It's the oldest lesson and story ever told to humanity. People knew about 7oh 10-15 years ago but no one synthesized it on a mass scale and threw it into every smoke shop until recently. Lawmakers were just fine with Kratom and plain leaf kratom really truly isn't harmful its mostly just beneficial. We ate from the forbidden fruit of knowledge and so many of us fell in love with it so now because of that we will have everything taken away from us most likely. They aren't going after just 7oh, they want it all gone. I wouldn't be surprised if in a year Kratom is obsolete from this entire country and every state will have laws that heavily ban it. Innocent people will probably be in jail for having a kilo of kratom powder... could you imagine that??? Imagine someone who just wanted a healthy alternative to opiates for pain and gets sentenced to jail time for having a kilo of kratom powder because to lawmakers a kilo will look like hes not only using but also selling and distributing...

I loved 7oh when I first found it, I genuinely thought it was a miracle. I used to take max 3 tablets a day and it felt like it gave me my life back. I was going to the gym again, my income was going up, my goals and dreams were being pursued instead of being put on the backburner. I was at more friends and family events than ever before. Fast forward a little over a year later and I was taking 15-20 pills a day. Is that on me? Yes. Does that mean 7oh is completely innocent? Not completely... I think I unfortunately share the same story with a lot of people and I sometimes wish I never found this because plain leaf Kratom was working so well all I needed was a tolerance break but instead of that I went for something stronger...

I genuinely hope for the best in whatever happens. Hopefully whatever outcome comes from this is good and normal considering both Kratom plain leaf powder and 7oh seem to be pretty safe when taken in large quantities. 7oh has absolutely without a doubt saved some people too I mean if I had debilitating pain or cancer or something extreme I wouldn't just want Kratom I would want 7oh too, why suffer when you can take something that helps? But unfortunately I think we ate from a fruit that we were never meant to touch and now pandoras box has been opened up and who knows what will happen next. I feel bad for the vendors who have families who rely on them to pay bills, I feel bad for people who rely on Kratom to stay off hard drugs, I feel bad for people who take Kratom for pain, I feel bad for everything. All we can do is hope for the best.

[LeafersonJr32]

If you mean by what you wrote are you going to convince me 7oh is bad then the answer is, no, you won't convince me. I've head ALL these same things about kratom (and before that, grass). And I've heard the EXACT SAME arguments made, by folks like yourself who don't seem to ever want to see the other side of things. So you, too, are not able or willing to listen to other arguments.

Which is fine - we will convince neither one of us. But one thing I WILL not stand for is for folks like yourself to push lies and falsehoods because of your fear that something MIGHT happen to hurt you in some way. Particularly when I've seen how wonderful 7oh is. So I will continue to tell folks how great it is, and you can go ahead and make your own posts about how bad it is and, so what? Folks will make up their own mind.

Which is fine.

What I'm saying is that it is important for both sides to make sure that 7ohm and kratom are able to be differentiated so that legislators and media don't just call them the same damn thing bc they are not the same. Also so that young people don't go into smoke shops and be told that 7ohm tablets are just kratom in pill form bc as I said if you really want 7ohm to stay legal that will be the main thing that gets it banned. As I said I feel there is no reason for 7ohm topics to be headlining the kratom section of this forum and quite honestly I find it very strange and pretty attention seeking that you feel the need to keep putting up 7ohm threads here in the kratom section knowing good and well the vast majority here don't like to see the 7ohm stuff here and just causes arguing.
[/quote]

[Kelleytoons]

Well, *I* find it strange that you can't stand to see any sort of positivity about it.

And on these forums we talk about a LOT of things that aren't kratom per se. So you are being disingenuous.

And, honestly, you are so full of BS I'm not going to bother to respond to you anymore (but I'll keep posting about how great 7oh is. LOL).

[IndelibleDotInk]

It's pretty amazing the way folks are SO judgmental on what folks use - and heaven forbid anyone judge THEM ("Judge not lest ye be judged?")

And ALL of it is completely stupid - the number one drug in terms of deaths and destruction, in terms of cost to society in every single way and yet NO ONE (well, I guess with minor country exceptions like some in the middle east) even wants to talk about a "ban" is alcohol. IOW - don't get me stared. If you are unwilling to stand on that hill to ban alcohol, you have no f##king business telling me what drug I can or can't use (because you are then the biggest hypocrite around).

At this point I have more than enough to last my lifetime so I'll just stay out of any discussion. But it certainly tells me how idiot a person is when he makes a certain stand.

Does the alcohol damage override the negative effect of nicotine/tobacco products?

[MikeEdoessomething]

https://www.reuters.com/press-releases/ ... 025-07-07/

Saw this pop up. Thoughts?

[BallzDeep9]

Saw this pop up. Thoughts?

That Reuters article, is part of new outreach being done by the HART Group (Holistic Alternative Recovery Trust), .. as there's FINALLY a bunch of Research studies coming out, regarding 7Oh.... As we predicted, the "Science" and History - There have been more than 500 million doses, taken over the last two years - and only five adverse effects have been reported.

https://www.denver7.com/news/state-news ... -on-monday

[mivanqua]

So, in an effort to keep their constituents happy, but only JUST ENOUGH, they are going to completely outlaw plain leaf and allow 7OHM to remain legal. Watch.

[KratomSavesLives24/7]

123456

[LeafersonJr32]

People saying 7ohm will not get banned...it is literally banned in my state right now. Lol And people saying "nothing is going to get banned because there aren't any overdoses"....we have seen multiple bans from states this year alone

[xymoriintus]

So, in an effort to keep their constituents happy, but only JUST ENOUGH, they are going to completely outlaw plain leaf and allow 7OHM to remain legal. Watch.

With how bass ackward this country is I honestly would not put that past these moronic lawmakers and regulators to do some retarded shit like that lol

[anonk]

I really feel like 7-oh is the end for kratom, with 3 state bans this year when January comes around you're going to see an absolute blood bath of bans. If we don't differentiate between plain leaf kratom and semi-synthetically produced 7-oh now ....

Fear-mongering. The Kratom community has ALWAYS had Fear mongering - pretty much every single YEAR since I've known it, like 9 years. Every single year BOOM here comes another 'round of Fear. Sooo silly and predictable, everyone runs out and... Grab grab grab, Buy buy buy... the vendors laugh & people stockpile TONS of dirty powder... then, the Fear goes away !!

The #1 Reason WHY 7-Hydroxy will NOT be "banned" IS: 7-Hydroxy Saves Lives... period. We've had - 100,000 DEAD, per Year, from Fent overdoses, across USA ... and "Plain Dirt" kratom isn't doing SHIT - to prevent those deaths. Only 7Oh is strong enough for the "Doper Community" ... to NOT seek out street Fent and be satisfied taking 7OH. And after 2+ Years - nobody has overdosed on 7OH. - Bottom Line. Yes, 7OH (and Kratom), should be State Regulated.

Now you can eat your words, first they came for 7-oh next they'll come for kratom.