Double M Herbals | Kratom Forum

Here we are, time to reveal our raffle winners. I know it has been an insanely long wait, I think you guys and gals are going to like how this works out. I wanted to first give my most sincere thank you to everyone who enrolled in our last public round of testing. Your time and efforts are invaluable to the work we do, none of what we have achieved thus far would be possible without it. Thank you.

Not to be captain obvious, but the reveal of our winners is LONG overdue. We have reasons for the long delay, but I never anticipated it taking this long.... I should have provided an update here in the interim.

The primary reason for such a long delay is that we totally botched the distribution of raffle tickets (for the record it was my fault). There were a bunch of testers that went out without a raffle ticket. As a result, we have been steadily getting emails from folks asking for a replacement ticket. Every time I thought I had waited long enough to go ahead and do the drawing, another person would email us about it. Its hard to define what what a "fair" cutoff is for something that was our mistake. Im know that the minute we post the winners, somebody is going to email us saying they never got a ticket.

I've been thinking a lot on how to best proceed, and the solution we came up with is a doozy. Before I share that solution, I wanted to share how we got there.

I thought about just holding the raffle and the people who follow up with us after the fact about not getting a ticket will just be automatic winners. However, I have a feeling that word on how that works would spread pretty quickly, and I don't want to create an incentive for folks to lie about not receiving one. When I pair this quandary with the fact that:

1. We have had memberships slots budgeted for a raffle for a long time now, but It's been so long since we've been able to actually hold a raffle. We had planned on holding an event and raffling spots off in Q1/Q2 of 2022, but we were never able to make that happen.
2. We also planned to hold a community flash sale around October/November in which we would also raffle off a few more memberships - but its not yet for certain if we will be able to do this.
3. We have made those who volunteered to wait far too long for the results.

Given that all of you have had to wait so patiently, and we have had these membership slots burning a hole in our pocket for long over a year, we are going to just go ahead and say that all testers who successfully submitted their surveys are the winners - welcome to the TFH!. Just shoot us an email at the same email address to claim your spot. I am VERY excited to have you all as part of the family, as what better people to invite than those who take time out of their busy lives to help further our cause? I know surveys are the last thing anyone wants to do for a company, and I feel very fortunate and appreciative of those who provided their 2 cents!

I wanted to just share for future reference that a membership raffle will never work out this way again.... this is a one-time thing. Although we didn't have a crazy amount of testers, this is going to be more memberships than the 20-40 we typically do each year. In other words, I hope nobody participates in a future round of research with the expectation of membership - our raffles will be an actual raffle in all future events. This is a once-in-a-lifetime thing, lol... congrats and thank you to those who participated!

Thank you family, and welcome to the Harvest!

Thanks for this, sent my email over.

Appreciate the consideration/seems fair to pay for shipping to have access to some quality product with a chance for membership. Excited to get a chance to sample it!

I’m a pretty thorough tester bit I have other samples to review for 2 weeks out. viewtopic.php?f=17&t=9684&p=101285#p101285
How soon do you need the test?

Application sent, thank you for your consideration!

Hi Chris, I’m so sorry - I was waaay too excited about this news and originally included an incorrect zip code on my application..
I replied to the email I initially sent with the corrected form showing my actual zip code. I hope I haven’t made things worse lol..
Thanks so much for allowing me an opportunity to apply, and I’m over the moon about the idea of an upcoming open event - even if I don’t get to help test!

Really awesome opportunity, thank you!

Thank you for the opportunity!!

So glad I logged on and saw this and hope I get selected, thank you!

You set this up so fast. Thank you so much!!

Thank you for the opportunity!!

This is an awesome post here. I've never had the opportunity to try anything from you. I've asked around and was then under the impression, according to a variety of answers I got, that it's difficult to become a member; and with that I just had my baby girl so I didn't even try honestly.
Good luck to everyone

Let’s go!!!!

Awesome!

It'd be an honor. Lol

Wow the timing on this is way too perfect for me, crossing my fingers!

Thanks for this opportunity!
If chosen I’ll take a break first so I’m starting with a clean slate.

Application sent, buuuutttt I messed up the ''forum'' section lol. Copy paste, and a dumb mistake. I won't burden you with another email as I'm sure you have received many, I'll just hope I'm still considered, and if not, hopefully I'll catch the next open event

Been a HUGE fan of TFH since the first sampler I grabbed off here almost a year ago now, and would LOVE the opportunity to test and become a member. I already keep a personal log of my daily uses and used to operate a kratom review subreddit, so testing is right up my alley.

Super awesome opportunity!!! Thank you!

Thank you for the quick reply and for opening up product testing to Double M members!

Thanks, I applied. Thanks for considering me.

@gumbyek1:
Can i participate from Germany if i am gonna pay the whole shipping costs?

I would soooo much love too. Would be such an honor for me? Maybe you can make that one-off exeption?

Thanks for the opportunity of applying to test your prospective offerings again! Application sent.

thank you for this opportunity. greatly looking forward to trying the samples.

Winning a TFH membership through the raffle is the closest I've come to winning the lotto lol.
Just seeing all the eager participants brings me joy, like I hold the golden key or something.
TFH is the best.

Can I apply from my igloo in Canada?

Just Emailed in my request. Hope I made it on time!

Thanks!

Adorable45Deplorable wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 12:43 pm Winning a TFH membership through the raffle is the closest I've come to winning the lotto lol.
Just seeing all the eager participants brings me joy, like I hold the golden key or something.
TFH is the best.

They are the best.

Even though I'm only going to be allowed to make ONE order, I'm going to make it count. Even the opportunity to order once from them has me smiling like a maniac.

Kelleytoons wrote: ↑Thu Aug 04, 2022 6:52 pm

Adorable45Deplorable wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 12:43 pm Winning a TFH membership through the raffle is the closest I've come to winning the lotto lol.
Just seeing all the eager participants brings me joy, like I hold the golden key or something.
TFH is the best.

They are the best.

Even though I'm only going to be allowed to make ONE order, I'm going to make it count. Even the opportunity to order once from them has me smiling like a maniac.

Never tried them, but are they really hands down better than everyone else? Just find it hard to believe they somehow find the same tree grown or processed in some special/unknown manner culminating in product superior to any other. Not saying it isnt but just not sure on that one. Or is it special cuz its not made readily available?

Im sure its very good, just the level of effort im seeing to test and garner feedback impresses me, they get it, marketing implements aside. Just curiousity on my part.

Eu4oric906 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:05 pm

Kelleytoons wrote: ↑Thu Aug 04, 2022 6:52 pm

Adorable45Deplorable wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 12:43 pm Winning a TFH membership through the raffle is the closest I've come to winning the lotto lol.
Just seeing all the eager participants brings me joy, like I hold the golden key or something.
TFH is the best.

They are the best.

Even though I'm only going to be allowed to make ONE order, I'm going to make it count. Even the opportunity to order once from them has me smiling like a maniac.

Never tried them, but are they really hands down better than everyone else? Just find it hard to believe they somehow find the same tree grown or processed in some special/unknown manner culminating in product superior to any other. Not saying it isnt but just not sure on that one. Or is it special cuz its not made readily available?

Im sure its very good, just the level of effort im seeing to test and garner feedback impresses me, they get it, marketing implements aside. Just curiousity on my part.

I don't know anything really, but I've picked up suggestions that the top harvesters in Indonesia have an amazing relationship with their trees. Maybe they control the shading they get and/or know exactly when to harvest from every tree limb. The drying process, which often includes some sun drying, is a real art as well, according to what I've read. So too is the grind, and knowing how much of the "bones" (the stem and vein) to use for some varieties.

Just sent my email—hopefully it’s not too late!

Eu4oric906 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:05 pm Never tried them, but are they really hands down better than everyone else? Just find it hard to believe they somehow find the same tree grown or processed in some special/unknown manner culminating in product superior to any other. Not saying it isnt but just not sure on that one. Or is it special cuz its not made readily available?

Whether the leaf itself is superior can be debated, for sure, but there is NO vendor like TFH, no matter how big (or how small). You need to do a forum search to see the exact process but unlike every other single vendor they control the growth of their leaf in ways others cannot, (and it is THEIR LEAF as opposed to selecting from bulk growers and distributors) and they also engage in testing in ways that others do not. Even the Mighty Mr. B admits they are the best - you literally can do no wrong no matter what strain you select from them.

However, again, you can find some very good powder elsewhere, to be sure. Elsewhere it's much more of a crapshoot, even among the very best, but by relying upon reviews posted (particularly on this forum) you can amass some excellent stuff.

Thanks for the detailed reply, good info and aspects I didnt know about. Good for them and for those of you who can enjoy their offerings.

Kelleytoons wrote: ↑Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:48 am

Eu4oric906 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:05 pm Never tried them, but are they really hands down better than everyone else? Just find it hard to believe they somehow find the same tree grown or processed in some special/unknown manner culminating in product superior to any other. Not saying it isnt but just not sure on that one. Or is it special cuz its not made readily available?

Whether the leaf itself is superior can be debated, for sure, but there is NO vendor like TFH, no matter how big (or how small). You need to do a forum search to see the exact process but unlike every other single vendor they control the growth of their leaf in ways others cannot, (and it is THEIR LEAF as opposed to selecting from bulk growers and distributors) and they also engage in testing in ways that others do not. Even the Mighty Mr. B admits they are the best - you literally can do no wrong no matter what strain you select from them.

However, again, you can find some very good powder elsewhere, to be sure. Elsewhere it's much more of a crapshoot, even among the very best, but by relying upon reviews posted (particularly on this forum) you can amass some excellent stuff.

I'm starting to get on board with this idea...I'm done with my testing and only had a few "duds" in the lot. Honestly I can see my self ordering some larger quantities of 4-8/the 11 I was given. Will probably try the ones I really liked again to make sure that my ratings are consistent.

I'd be interested in knowing some more about how the sourcing was done and a little behind the scenes for each batch, these didn't seem like "blends" of the same leaf to me or else the effects would have decreased after consistent use.

IIRC (and I think I do in this case) one of the ways they make sure their leaf is SPECIFICALLY grown for them is to have the growers photograph the growing with current newspapers, under conditions that would be almost impossible to photoshop. IOW - they aren't over them themselves but they go through a LOT of effort to make sure they can control their source in ways no one else even tries.

I still have four samples left to try but there are definitely two out of the seven I've tested so far that I will be ordering - no duds but those two were superior to almost anything I've had from anyone. And then I will also take the opportunity to buy whatever the heck else they sell I can afford (and even what I can't afford :>). It's been an honor to be part of this process but even more to be given the opportunity for a one-time purchase.

The "behind the scenes" post he did was absolutely enlightening. The level of seriousness, dedication, and persistence is incredible. You have to LOVE your product and your customers to work that hard at getting the best of the best. Reminds me of Popcorn Sutton, the old moonshiner (look him up on youtube if you haven't seen him)!

Glad to have found MMs and a chance to try some TFH samples.

Cheers.

Hey everyone - I just wanted to provide a real quick update to let everyone know that we are a little behind in keeping up with the volunteer requests. Please dont worry if you haven't heard from us yet - we will get back to everyone eventually! We had to take a temporary pause on enrolling volunteers, I expect that it will likely be Tuesday before we get caught up with requests that have been submitted at the time of this comment. If you have submitted your application before 8/6 and haven't heard back by the end of Tuesday, feel free to send a follow up email (on a separate email thread - do not reply on your original email).

Thanks so much for the enthusiasm and kind words some of you have shared - its awesome to engage with so many excited enthusiasts. I dont know if it's the kratom or what - but the members of this forum are some of the kindest folks on the internet. Im sincerely so appreciative that we get to do this with the folks here.... good stuff!

Just a quick update and a few points of clarity -

Delays with enrollment and email replies: We are really far behind with enrollments, so please expect that it may take several days for us to respond to your application. We had many more volunteers than we needed, so we are expanding the scope of our testing to accommodate the excess of volunteers. With that, we took an operational pause on testing to evaluate the data we have received so far to determine if there were any samples we needed more data on, and to determine the structure of our next round. We appreciate your patience, we hope to get caught up a bit in the next day or two.

At this time, we still have enrollments from 8/1 that have yet to be processed, so dont worry if you've been waiting for a reply and think we have overlooked you. Even if we do not accept your application for testing, we will inform you as much, so you will get an email reply from us one way or another. I expect that by the end of the day Tuesday, we will get caught up on the emails that are currently in queue.

Membership Raffle: The only formal path to membership with TFH is our membership raffle that we hold 1-2 times a year. Every tester should have received a blue ticket with their package which is for our membership raffle. Unfortunately, we discovered that all of the test packages were shipped in our first round of testing. If you received your package without a ticket, you may email us to request a digital ticket (we will simply assign you the numbers of a raffle ticket....it will be essentially the same thing). Please note that in order for your ticket to be valid, you must complete all of your surveys.

The date of the raffle is to be determined, but it will probably be a few weeks for now in order to give everyone a chance who is testing to complete thier surveys. We have somewhere around 36-40 batches currently in testing, so we are still enrolling applicants. When we hold the raffle, a random number generator will select the winning numbers and we will post them at the very beginning of this thread.

Testing Instructions: Upon submitting payment for shipping, you receive a payment confirmation email (within 24 hours or so). This email will also include the testing instructions, which is where you can find the survey link, along with specifics on how to grade each batch. Please carefully read these to ensure you are following the guidelines. If you did not receive the testing instructions, that means that you did not submit payment, or for some reason, we did not acknowledge your payment. If you did submit payment and haven't received the instructions, just shoot us an email.


Thank you again everyone for your support!

Hello Everyone - I wanted to provide a few quick updates, see below:

1. Testing Closed: First and foremost thank everyone for your incredible support will this round of testing. We have received all of the volunteers we can manage at this time, so we are no longer accepting applicants. We actually had so many volunteers that we were able to do several rounds all at once! While we always have research to do and new batches to test - we have to take an operational pause on consumer research to catch up. Thanks for the support!

2. Volunteer Orders: We are behind... like REALLY behind!!! We really need a little bit of patience and grace from everyone, sorry! Typically our turnaround time on orders is less than 24 hours, but almost everybody who volunteered is placing orders.... large orders so it has got us backed up quite a bit. I promise we will get to everyone, and we will not run out of any of the items that were in testing (with the exception of 1, please see below). I know folks tend to worry whenever they dont hear back about an order so I wanted to just put a blanket notice that your order is not being missed! A million thanks for your patience!

3. Red 592: Many people are requesting test Red 592, and unfortunately, we are completely out of that batch. Red 592 was actually a menu item we threw into the testing because we needed more data on how it directly compared to another batch (Green 601) that was from the same source but a later harvest. If you already submitted an order for it, you might be receiving an email from us requesting a substitution for it. In case you were wondering, the follow-up harvest (Green 601) is available in case you want to get that instead. However, I want to share that the survey data indicates that the 601 is slightly less preferred than the Red 592 harvest... but they both scored well. Some people actually preferred the Green 601 over the Red 592... its a matter of personal chemistry there. At any rate, I wanted to be transparent that the batches are not identical in case you were thinking about blindly swapping out your kilogram of 592 with Green 601.

4. Membership Raffle: See our previous post regarding raffle tickets if you have not done so already. Our raffle will be held in the coming weeks, and the winners will be posted at the beginning of this thread. We will change the subject of the thread as well so that its crystal clear where to look.

Again a huge thank you to everyone who participated. Its always nice to mingle with some folks we haven't met before, and we are always blown away by the support of this community. Amazing!

Just put in my one time order request, I guess I was a little too slow to get Red 592 hopefully my favorite red-like green will still be in stock (gonna get 1kg)!

Thanks for everything you guys are doing/I'm looking forward to the raffle.

Arob1000 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 7:29 pm Just put in my one time order request, I guess I was a little too slow to get Red 592 hopefully my favorite red-like green will still be in stock (gonna get 1kg)!

Thanks for everything you guys are doing/I'm looking forward to the raffle.

I think it was mentioned that Red 592 was on the menu until recently. If you find out the name of it, you could ask on the trading post. Someone may have some to spare

Now I'm curious as to what the Red 592 was listed under on the menu

MikeEdoessomething wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 7:38 pm

Arob1000 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 7:29 pm Just put in my one time order request, I guess I was a little too slow to get Red 592 hopefully my favorite red-like green will still be in stock (gonna get 1kg)!

Thanks for everything you guys are doing/I'm looking forward to the raffle.

I think it was mentioned that Red 592 was on the menu until recently. If you find out the name of it, you could ask on the trading post. Someone may have some to spare

Now I'm curious as to what the Red 592 was listed under on the menu

Red 592 is Top Shelf Red Bali MUK-SD9G. It was out of stock for me when I ordered, 8(