Herbal RVA Kratom Research

[Jfish030]

We are looking for 10g samples of this community's favorite kratom powder. In return I will provide the mit% of this powder to you for free in exchange for 10grams of powder. I need the community's agreement on some must test samples. I cant afford to do tons of samples. A good dozen or so samples is what we are looking for. Anyone have suggestions on strains/batches to look for from other vendors?

Also what companies have labs visible online? What company's have labs visible online with the additional alkaloids? (these labs will help us save a little bit of money in the long run) We just need all the data we can get. Thank you.

[Jfish030]

Basic findings so far.

Red Strains are overall weaker. Less of the alkaloids in general with some having the highest 7ohm.
Greens having the most akaloids and whites 2nd most. Will continue to do more research just need more labs

[Lokey]

I'm a little confused. You want people to send you 10g samples of strains they want labs done on? You also want to know vendors who have labs available on alkaloids? I know Benni's has labs but probably have to ask for them.

[Kelleytoons]

The other thing about this that's weird is that there really aren't "reds" or "greens" - one vendor's red could easily be another's green. It's a VERY arbitrary thing to say that "reds strains are overall weaker".

This whole thing is a bit suspicious to me.

[BallzDeep9]

Also what companies have labs visible online? What company's have labs visible online with the additional alkaloids? (these labs will help us save a little bit of money in the long run) We just need all the data we can get.

Haven't taken a Survey lately, lol but majority of, traditional online vendors show NO Labs... have Zero accounting for what's in their "strains".

So the 5,000 "strains" aka Plain Leaf products For Sale at any given time, are just... powder in a bag. NO percentage % of Active ingredients. NO standardized -herbal supplements- for kratom... (What are standardized herbs?)

This has allowed "Big Kratom" profiteers, to flood the market with cheap Low quality powder... So, Thanks for your efforts. It's TIME to get a handle on what's being sold out there... What consumers can expect / should expect to get for their $ Kratom dollars!

[Jfish030]

Yeah i was hoping some one could spare 10grams of their favorite batches. The hype batches. Like sosa old leaf and so forth. To get lab results to show the person what to look for in future leaf for free to them. Its a $300 value trade for 10grams of powder. Someone at the least can spare some powder for research.

Yes i know many people mix their reds up and just use weak greens and such. The data is already showing this. My friend whos expert at excel has alot of forumlas and can pretty much do anything with the data from finding data that is abnormally high and splitting the strains by color, red,white, green. So if i see a red with high mit and everything else high like all 100 other greens then you can assume its probably actually a green, but for now the data stays as a red and can be modified later. There is also some cool finds already for some of the additional akaloids.

Ballzdeep yes very few actually show their labs. Many are as anti transparent as can be. Some dont have any and others ask you for a code on your bag to get the lab, which means you have to buy it to get the lab, if you get a lab. The ones that do post, im finding some labs that are failing labs.


So far we have around 300 labs inputted with most having the 5-7 additional alkaloids. I Herbal RVA personally have at least 100 labs myself with just the mit and 7ohm but for now the focus is to start with labs with the additional alkaloids. Will compile at least 500-600 labs with additional alkaloids before piling on the mit and 7ohm labs that i can get. Hoping for atleast 500 labs with additional akaloids and another 500 with just the mit and 7ohm data. At that point we will have a serious compilation of kratom and what it tests as.

[Lokey]

I don't get how anyone will get lab results on any future free kratom given to them.

[IjustFeltLikeRunnin’]

I don't get how anyone will get lab results on any future free kratom given to them.

He’s saying he will get lab results on a favorite batch you have, so you know what sort of profile to look for when you purchase future batches, and he will cover the cost of the lab testing. So it’s free to you.

[Lokey]

Thank you, but you can't look for future profiles if the lab results aren't offered or available especially with multiple alks which is mainly the current situation.

[mivanqua]

Thank you, but you can't look for future profiles if the lab results aren't offered or available especially with multiple alks which is mainly the current situation.

I don't think that's what this is about. What address do we send the samples to? Maybe hippies RVA Green Bali in the Sun experiment might be fun. I still have some of the sun baked one if you guys can come up with the plain Green Bali. I would definitely be interested in this, but I have a sneaking suspicion you're just trying to steal my good stuff.

Seriously though, what's the address you want them sent to, I can think of a few fun ones for sure.

[IjustFeltLikeRunnin’]

Thank you, but you can't look for future profiles if the lab results aren't offered or available especially with multiple alks which is mainly the current situation.

It sounds like this is an issue he is trying to address. He commented that a large number of vendors either don’t offer labs, make it hard to access them, or the labs they do offer are not matching up with the results he is obtaining.

If it became the norm to test for alkaloid profiles, and offer those results to customers, they would be more inclined to purchase batches with profiles they know work for them.

In theory it sounds like a great idea….

[Lokey]

Right, but having your favorite strain (or batch) tested now to know what the profile is is one thing, using that to buy batches that closely match what you like is a long way off if at all. I don't mind sending samples however.

[Jfish030]

Yeah i wasn't trying to show to much of what im doing but if it works its going to be game changing. There's things you want for a good green and things you want for a good red based on the alkaloids. These labs wont create holy grail of kratom powder but will for sure help with consistency per strain over multiple restocks/batches. Now if you add in blending you might be able to create some kratom powder that works very good consistently.


You can ship them to my PO box. Please include strain name and batch# if you can. I can email you the results or mail back a paper copy of the lab. You can ship the 10g sample in a ziplock bag if you wish and use a envelope with 1 stamp (less the $1) for shipping. Were looking for good reds and green strain that were really popular with the entire community if possible.

Jonathan Fisher
PO BOX 2011
Mechanicsville Va 23116




The reason everyone started testing is because of the salmonella outbreak years ago. The people not testing now mainly consist of people who weren't selling back then. Another salmonella or bad ecoli outbreak is not good at all for kratom, it adds another reason to either regulate it harder or ban it completely.

[PistolsAtDawn]

-snip-

I was thinking of sending you a sample of Heaven Leaf's Royal Gold, which for me is one of the most consistent batches for fighting anxiety. But I won't if you're only looking for greens and reds.

I don't have many "legendary" batches, and my taste in kratom is slower and more relaxing. Stimulation isn't what I need from kratom (and the majority of the white batches I've had make me jittery and angry).

I'll try to think about any others that I have that are amazing. What about fermented/oxidized reds?

Why not also test white varieties?

[Lokey]

Thinking I'll send a couple that were raved about by several but did nothing for me. Wish I saved the TFH empty sample/test bags. Is it possible 8g would suffice?

[Kelleytoons]

Thinking I'll send a couple that were raved about by several but did nothing for me. Wish I saved the TFH empty sample/test bags. Is it possible 8g would suffice?

I'd have to send capsules but otherwise it's actually a pretty great idea - send off the stuff that doesn't hit and see if there's any science behind why it doesn't.

However, I'm guessing (just based on how TFH tests their stuff - not only analysis but the human testing) that all we would find is that some people like some things and others don't, because the analysis isn't going to analyze for EVERYTHING (just the major factors). We already know alkaloid levels mean little to whether something works for someone or not, with some high stuff and some low stuff being just as good (to the same person).

But, again, I'd play if the gentleman wants to open up a bunch of capsules I made <bg>.

[Jfish030]

Thinking I'll send a couple that were raved about by several but did nothing for me. Wish I saved the TFH empty sample/test bags. Is it possible 8g would suffice?

I'd have to send capsules but otherwise it's actually a pretty great idea - send off the stuff that doesn't hit and see if there's any science behind why it doesn't.

However, I'm guessing (just based on how TFH tests their stuff - not only analysis but the human testing) that all we would find is that some people like some things and others don't, because the analysis isn't going to analyze for EVERYTHING (just the major factors). We already know alkaloid levels mean little to whether something works for someone or not, with some high stuff and some low stuff being just as good (to the same person).

But, again, I'd play if the gentleman wants to open up a bunch of capsules I made <bg>.

10 grams is the minimum they need. Is this powder that's capsulized from a batch that many liked? If so send it over. The reason some kratom doesnt work and some does is the balance of MIT vs other alkaloids and your level of mit intake (mit tolerance).

Below is all speculative information on kratom powder, i could be way off. Im not a chemist nor a doctor and this is all blowing air at this point




A low mit red with decent levels of the other akaloids looks to be the best red, for people that actually seek reds for relief. (the data i have so far shows mit as being lower and as of right now the other akaloids are similar to other colors)

Every single person taking kratom develops a mit tolerance especially if your using greens/whites. Its the major alkaloid in the plant and your brain seeks it. (mit is like the sugar to everything sweet you seek) Obtaining the needed mit isn't the issue with the majority of kratom, but the kratom experience most people seek is just above feeling good and happy that you achieved enough mit. (its ok kratom, or its good kratom) That area of effect is the hardest part as a person trying to figure it out because your state of mind plays a role in your overall well being after you achieve enough mit. Maybe a little muscle relaxation to take the edge off plus achieving enough mit is key?? Idk yet.

[Jfish030]

Thinking I'll send a couple that were raved about by several but did nothing for me. Wish I saved the TFH empty sample/test bags. Is it possible 8g would suffice?

The lab company says 10grams min. Please include strain name, batch number if possible, if no batch number please include purchase date.

[Jfish030]

-snip-

I was thinking of sending you a sample of Heaven Leaf's Royal Gold, which for me is one of the most consistent batches for fighting anxiety. But I won't if you're only looking for greens and reds.

I don't have many "legendary" batches, and my taste in kratom is slower and more relaxing. Stimulation isn't what I need from kratom (and the majority of the white batches I've had make me jittery and angry).

I'll try to think about any others that I have that are amazing. What about fermented/oxidized reds?

Why not also test white varieties?

You can send it, as of right now ive isolated golds/yellows. I will either keep them isolated or split them between red/white. Yes fermented reds, or the red reds are generally what reds were always up until the past year or so. You had light reds and then dark reds, now you have green reds. A bit confusing now adays

[Lokey]

I don't know, seems like it's a lot more than just mit tolerance to me. Two strains that everyone loved are TFH Red 707 (Jolly Red Giant) and 30 Year Wild Jade Hulu (green). When I tested red 707 it didn't seem to work at all. Same thing happened yesterday with the WJH. I took some when I woke up and it didn't seem to work so I took some more and after 6g still felt nothing! So I took about 2.2g more of something totally different and then said what the heck may as well add more since I wasn't feeling anything but I had a sense it was too much because even though I couldn't feel it I knew it was "there". Sure enough I went from nothing directly into wobbles. So the WJH was doing something, I just couldn't feel it. I waited a couple hours at least also.

I'll try them both again, I've heard some say that some strains take trying several times before they "hit".

On the other hand the strains I took today definitely helped, Philly's super green and later on Lucky's green MD.

Just got a D615 gold everyone loves so will be interesting.

[Kelleytoons]

Mit tolerance can't explain a lot of things - which is why I'm extremely skeptical labs will be worthwhile for anything. As you noted, folks can rave about one batch that has no effect on others, and vice versa. And tolerance would not explain in the slightest why taking the same strain repeatedly THEN works.

I'm pretty sure this will require a LOT more scientific research, including blind studies and tests (TFH does do something like this but it's not a controlled study). And it's unlikely to ever happen. In the meantime the absolute best we will ever have is anecdotal evidence and finding someone who reacts the way you do to the same batches is golden (there is one member here who I almost always agree with - but I won't mention names. Everyone needs to find their own guidance).

[Lokey]

I can confirm that for me the Gold Kenong is very very good so at least I can rely on some reviews if not all, just never know which ones.

[jrose100]

I think this could turn out to be some great info if enough people do it.

[BallzDeep9]

A low mit red with decent levels of the other akaloids looks to be the best red, for people that actually seek reds for relief. (the data i have so far shows mit as being lower and as of right now the other akaloids are similar to other colors)

Every single person taking kratom develops a mit tolerance especially if your using greens/whites. Its the major alkaloid in the plant and your brain seeks it. (mit is like the sugar to everything sweet you seek) Obtaining the needed mit isn't the issue with the majority of kratom, but the kratom experience most people seek is just above feeling good and happy that you achieved enough mit. (its ok kratom, or its good kratom) That area of effect is the hardest part as a person trying to figure it out because your state of mind plays a role in your overall well being after you achieve enough mit. Maybe a little muscle relaxation to take the edge off plus achieving enough mit is key?? Idk yet.

Well I won't say it's ALL about the Mit - however there's just no data to suggest the "other alkaloids" are present in sufficient quantity, to do anything ?? The old theory about Sun dried oxidized Reds, having more 7-Hydroxymitragynine... has been disproven. There is NOT enough 7-Ohm present in plain leaf kratom, to cause threshold effects. Science has discovered that 7-Ohm is, in fact - produced in the body, metabolized from... Mitragynine.

The KEY factor seems to be... "Good Kratom" has almost, TWICE as much Mit per gram ? compared to Low quality, bulk kratom, which is now unfortunately the majority of stuff being imported. "Big Batch" wholesale bulk, most of which goes right down to Florida & Texas drug labs where the Mit gets extracted and made into MIT-45 shots and OPMS shots... and the majority of vendors now, who buy Domestic from wholesalers (and Do Not lab test potency,), are selling plain leaf below 1% Mit.

Standardized herbs, and potency testing - IS the wave of the future for kratom. Seems we are only now, getting started with vendors and HPLC testing their batches.

[xymoriintus]

A low mit red with decent levels of the other akaloids looks to be the best red, for people that actually seek reds for relief. (the data i have so far shows mit as being lower and as of right now the other akaloids are similar to other colors)

Every single person taking kratom develops a mit tolerance especially if your using greens/whites. Its the major alkaloid in the plant and your brain seeks it. (mit is like the sugar to everything sweet you seek) Obtaining the needed mit isn't the issue with the majority of kratom, but the kratom experience most people seek is just above feeling good and happy that you achieved enough mit. (its ok kratom, or its good kratom) That area of effect is the hardest part as a person trying to figure it out because your state of mind plays a role in your overall well being after you achieve enough mit. Maybe a little muscle relaxation to take the edge off plus achieving enough mit is key?? Idk yet.

Well I won't say it's ALL about the Mit - however there's just no data to suggest the "other alkaloids" are present in sufficient quantity, to do anything ?? The old theory about Sun dried oxidized Reds, having more 7-Hydroxymitragynine... has been disproven. There is NOT enough 7-Ohm present in plain leaf kratom, to cause threshold effects. Science has discovered that 7-Ohm is, in fact - produced in the body, metabolized from... Mitragynine.

The KEY factor seems to be... "Good Kratom" has almost, TWICE as much Mit per gram ? compared to Low quality, bulk kratom, which is now unfortunately the majority of stuff being imported. "Big Batch" wholesale bulk, most of which goes right down to Florida & Texas drug labs where the Mit gets extracted and made into MIT-45 shots and OPMS shots... and the majority of vendors now, who buy Domestic from wholesalers (and Do Not lab test potency,), are selling plain leaf below 1% Mit.

Standardized herbs, and potency testing - IS the wave of the future for kratom. Seems we are only now, getting started with vendors and HPLC testing their batches.