Dealing with Dealers (cars)

[Greyfeather]

Hi friends,
It's been a very long time. Happy to see everyone still here.
We can't put it off much longer - need to buy a car. A new one this time. We want to pay cash but I keep reading that this is the worst idea because once they know they just start piling on more charges, fines, fees, etc because apparently they make more money when you finance through them. I have watched some youtubes but get conflicting messages.
One guy suggests that you go ahead and finance because you'll get a better Out The Door price. Then take the car home and write them a check 30 days later. But only if they don't have a penalty for early payment. Just the thought of dealing with another dealer is turning me into a wreck.
They all lie like rugs and we all know it and with the current situation they are loving being able to get what they want.

Any advice?
I loved my little 20 year old Kia so we were going to get a Kia but cancelled because of all of the engine problems, etc. That was close. So now we're looking at a Toyota Rav4 or a Toyota Corolla Cross.

[herbalhippie]

Any advice?
I loved my little 20 year old Kia so we were going to get a Kia but cancelled because of all of the engine problems, etc. That was close. So now we're looking at a Toyota Rav4 or a Toyota Corolla Cross.

I just bought a new Corolla Cross in July and I LOVE it. Second choice would have been a Rav4 but it was a bit more.

So I don't know if you've been in to the Toyota dealer yet but you need to know that they're not easy to get. It will be rare to find one
on the lot because they're in such high demand. I'll just give you my story.

My old Grand Caravan was looking like it was thinking about throwing the tranny so I started looking into another used car. I already
knew there was nothing decent on Craigslist so I started looking at dealerships in the area and decent used cars were damn near as
much as a new car and with no warranty. Ok so new it is. I haven't bought a new car since....many years ago.

I was looking at Hondas (out of my budget), Nissan (probable eventual transmission issues), Subaru (also out of my budget) and then
Toyota. Figured I'd look at the Corolla and the Corolla Cross but the Rav4 was a little more than I wanted to spend.

So I go up to the dealership which is about a mile from my house on a Saturday morning. Salesman comes out. Tells me they have
neither one of those two cars for me to test drive. He showed me an older Corolla and I didn't much care for the size. There was
no Cross on the lot but he said it was just a bit smaller than this Rav4 over here and was I interested in test driving that? No.

Turns out that even though a car shows on the dealer's website, it doesn't mean it's on the lot, or even built yet. What is on the dealer's
website are allocations from Toyota. When I went up there they had 4 Corolla Crosses on the website and 3 of them already had
deposits on them. The only one available was an L trim (lowest trim package) in Celestite and did I want to put $1k deposit on it? I had
never heard of buying a car like this. I told him I'd think about it.

This was Saturday morning. I went home and started researching and reading and I was back up at the dealer at opening time
Monday morning with a thousand in cash and praying no one else had claimed that car on Saturday after I left. They were asking
$2k over MSRP and this is standard damn near everywhere in the country. I got them down $1k, gave them my deposit and started waiting.

This was June 12th. The car was built on June 29th and I got it on July 26th.

My suggestion is if you do go for a Cross to get the LE trim package if you can. The L trim does not have a rear window wiper or the
blind spot monitor and those are the only two things I wish I had, although I am fine without them and am perfectly happy with the car.

Keep in mind that unless you get lucky and find a dealer with one on the lot you'll be waiting from a couple weeks to a couple months
probably. Maybe even longer. I've seen stories of people waiting to get on a waiting list just to be able to claim an allocation when it comes in.
At least you're not in Canada where some people have waited a year to get one of these. I was VERY lucky in that I went up to the dealer
at a time when they'd just gotten an allocation and it wasn't claimed yet.

Oh yeah, I figured my out the door price, the price I was willing to pay plus tax and licensing and all that just a few days before
the car came in and I ended up paying $600 over that. I wrote it off to convenience seeing as how the dealer is practically in
my neighborhood. I did get Toyota financing and I'm not happy with the interest rate but I can get it refinanced
later through my credit union. I'll probably look into that next spring.

Was the car worth a month and a half wait? Yes.

Here are a couple places where you can read stories about Corolla Crosses, people trying to get one, etc.

https://old.reddit.com/r/CorollaCross/

https://www.corollacrossforum.com/

Here's mine!

https://old.reddit.com/r/CorollaCross/c ... ar_hauler/


edit: My main two choices were a Corolla Cross or a Nissan Kicks. We had rented a Kicks for a roadtrip last year and I really liked it. But when
I started researching them it turns out that they're knows for transmission issues. These cars have CVT transmissions and Nissan hasn't gotten
theirs down yet, Toyota has. Plus when I was reading up on the Cross there was a thread about Kicks or Cross? and one person claimed to
be a Nissan mechanic and said don't buy one because they're not a good car. His exact words were 'these cars are a piece of crap, don't buy it" lol

edit 2: Here's a current thread about what people are paying for these, what the dealers are charging.

https://old.reddit.com/r/CorollaCross/c ... e_at_msrp/

[IjustFeltLikeRunnin’]

My husband works for the GM dealership in our town. He’s been there 11 years and has done everything from selling, to ordering, dealer trading for vehicles you want but they don’t have on their own lot (yes, they will locate a vehicle you are interested in, then negotiate with that dealership to get the vehicle to theirs to sell to you), to finance (which he does now).

While I get where car salesman get their bad rap, if you buy from a reputable dealership, and not the place that temporarily sets up shop in the mall parking lot, you really will not have to deal with all the BS.

Ask about incentives and rebates. They change every month, and you can get a better deal if you utilize them.

They really don’t make the brunt of their money off financing. Most of it comes from their used car sales, after-market add-ons like warranties and accessories, and their mechanic/body shop (if they have one).

You should never feel pressured, intimidated or shafted when you are purchasing a vehicle. If you do, you are at the wrong place!!

[IndelibleDotInk]

My dad just folds his arms and says, 'I don't understand,' when the salesman starts talking extra fees; he makes the salesman slash those and a few thousand dollars more. He's done it for used and new cars, it always works, on a lot of used cars, including my Starion beater I used to drive to school twenty years ago, and a brand new Lexus he got for my mom, and a new Hyundai Santa Fe (great vehicle so far). A guy rear-ended us and the dealership took care of all our probs.

If you like Kia, they are a sister brand from Hyundai. Genesis used to be a sports car and two luxury cars under Hyundai, but now they are a stand-alone brand, dropped the sports car and just carry luxury now. They're incredibly pricy, I'm not sure what's so great about them, but I sure wouldn't turn one down. I guess what I'm saying is: I recommend Hyundai, they have a strong warranty, solid machinery (from Korea).

[MetalMamaRocks]

I actually bought a new Kia Seltos SX in 2021 and I love it! The turbo engine hasn't had any recalls on it and I've put 20,000 miles on mine with no issues.

You guys are right about Nissans. My brother bought 2 brand new and within a couple of years had to replace the transmissions in both of them.

[IndelibleDotInk]

I think it's unusual how Kia was the inexpensive line of Hyundai. Then they changed it up to focus on young people and the Kia Soul blew up, everyone had them and they were quality. Then Kia came out with other types and styles of cars like the Stinger sedan which had a pretty piece of fast engine under the hood. I was bummed the Hyundai spun off the Genesis luxury cars into it's own line and dropped the Genesis coup, which had so much potential.

[herbalhippie]

I wouldn't buy a Kia or a Hyundai. Just personal opinion. A friend has a 2018 or 2019 Sportage and loved it.
She's already put 86k miles on it though and it thinking about a Toyota now.

[herbalhippie]

You guys are right about Nissans. My brother bought 2 brand new and within a couple of years had to replace the transmissions in both of them.

I'm so glad I'm so obsessive about researching large purchases or I might have bought a Kicks, I liked that rental so much. Whew. Dodged a bullet I think.

[MetalMamaRocks]

I wouldn't buy a Kia or a Hyundai. Just personal opinion. A friend has a 2018 or 2019 Sportage and loved it.
She's already put 86k miles on it thought and it thinking about a Toyota now.

The older Kias are susceptible to theft via the "TicToc Kia Boyz challenge". Some insurance companies are even canceling insurance on them or raising rates. There's probably a class action lawsuit in the works. The newer models have immobilizers and can't be stolen as easily, but even though I love mine I don't know if I would buy another one. Depends on how the insurance issue goes.

When I was looking, I researched vehicles for around 6 months before deciding on the Kia. I have a 2006 Camry with over 200,000 miles on it so was leaning towards a RAV4. I changed my mind when I saw the amount of recalls on the 2019 and 2020 models. The 2019 Camrys also had a lot of issues, especially with the CVT transmissions. Toyota probably has the bugs worked out on that now, but they also just had a big recall on the Tundras, I can't remember what for. I also really, really wanted a Charger and test drove one, but was afraid to pull the trigger after researching them.

With all of the issues new cars seem to have, it's hard to decide what to buy. They sure don't make them like they used to! The website Carcomplaints.com has a lot of good info on all makes and models. So does Edmunds.

[IndelibleDotInk]

The Charger became one of the most popular cars for the police here, that and the 4Runner.

[herbalhippie]

I wouldn't buy a Kia or a Hyundai. Just personal opinion. A friend has a 2018 or 2019 Sportage and loved it.
She's already put 86k miles on it thought and it thinking about a Toyota now.

The older Kias are susceptible to theft via the "TicToc Kia Boyz challenge". Some insurance companies are even canceling insurance on them or raising rates. There's probably a class action lawsuit in the works. The newer models have immobilizers and can't be stolen as easily, but even though I love mine I don't know if I would buy another one. Depends on how the insurance issue goes.

When I was looking, I researched vehicles for around 6 months before deciding on the Kia. I have a 2006 Camry with over 200,000 miles on it so was leaning towards a RAV4. I changed my mind when I saw the amount of recalls on the 2019 and 2020 models. The 2019 Camrys also had a lot of issues, especially with the CVT transmissions. Toyota probably has the bugs worked out on that now, but they also just had a big recall on the Tundras, I can't remember what for. I also really, really wanted a Charger and test drove one, but was afraid to pull the trigger after researching them.

With all of the issues new cars seem to have, it's hard to decide what to buy. They sure don't make them like they used to! The website Carcomplaints.com has a lot of good info on all makes and models. So does Edmunds.

There were two recalls on the Corolla Cross I got and mine was built just after they got the issues sorted out, so I got lucky there.

[MetalMamaRocks]

That's good! I haven't seen any out in the wild yet, but it looks like a cool vehicle!

[herbalhippie]

That's good! I haven't seen any out in the wild yet, but it looks like a cool vehicle!

I've only seen two others in 4 1/2 months.

[Greyfeather]

Please forgive me for not logging in sooner, folks, and thank you everyone for your help.
And it really is so helpfull. A lot to think about here.

Seriously looking at the Corolla Cross (maybe the Rav4). I expect no matter what we decide we'll be waiting a while, unless we get lucky. I need some good luck so badly.

Everyone stay safe out there, please? It isn't the topic, but we're having covid cases all over and no one is reporting them. I just hear about it through a broken grapevine. I still have Long covid after 10 months and my Guy caught it in September. And if you meet up for Thanksgivinig, enjoy yourselves and be careful on those roads! People in my city have absolutely lost their minds. Insurance is sky high because of all the uninsured people. I found out that even if they hit someone all they get is a thousand dollar fine!!! No matter the mayhem.

And if you have family who truly, honestly love you - love them back. Times are strange and getting stranger.

[herbalhippie]

Please forgive me for not logging in sooner, folks, and thank you everyone for your help.
And it really is so helpfull. A lot to think about here.

Seriously looking at the Corolla Cross (maybe the Rav4). I expect no matter what we decide we'll be waiting a while, unless we get lucky. I need some good luck so badly.

Everyone stay safe out there, please? It isn't the topic, but we're having covid cases all over and no one is reporting them. I just hear about it through a broken grapevine. I still have Long covid after 10 months and my Guy caught it in September. And if you meet up for Thanksgivinig, enjoy yourselves and be careful on those roads! People in my city have absolutely lost their minds. Insurance is sky high because of all the uninsured people. I found out that even if they hit someone all they get is a thousand dollar fine!!! No matter the mayhem.

And if you have family who truly, honestly love you - love them back. Times are strange and getting stranger.

Times are getting stranger and I don't like it. And it seems to be happening so fast.

I went out to lunch yesterday with a friend from Seattle I haven't seen since before the pandemic and I also haven't eaten in a restaurant since before the pandemic so
that was a little worrisome. I picked the place where it would be likely that most people were vaxxed and we also went right at opening at 11:00, so there were only
a few other people.

I will wish for good things for you, Greyfeather, and petition Universe on your behalf. <3

[Greyfeather]

Please forgive me for not logging in sooner, folks, and thank you everyone for your help.
And it really is so helpfull. A lot to think about here.

Seriously looking at the Corolla Cross (maybe the Rav4). I expect no matter what we decide we'll be waiting a while, unless we get lucky. I need some good luck so badly.

Everyone stay safe out there, please? It isn't the topic, but we're having covid cases all over and no one is reporting them. I just hear about it through a broken grapevine. I still have Long covid after 10 months and my Guy caught it in September. And if you meet up for Thanksgivinig, enjoy yourselves and be careful on those roads! People in my city have absolutely lost their minds. Insurance is sky high because of all the uninsured people. I found out that even if they hit someone all they get is a thousand dollar fine!!! No matter the mayhem.

And if you have family who truly, honestly love you - love them back. Times are strange and getting stranger.

Times are getting stranger and I don't like it. And it seems to be happening so fast.

I went out to lunch yesterday with a friend from Seattle I haven't seen since before the pandemic and I also haven't eaten in a restaurant since before the pandemic so
that was a little worrisome. I picked the place where it would be likely that most people were vaxxed and we also went right at opening at 11:00, so there were only
a few other people.

I will wish for good things for you, Greyfeather, and petition Universe on your behalf. <3

Thank you so much HH,

Your trials with COVID were the first reported here, as I recall; and I know how hard it was for you
We don't go out much, but I'm looking for work. I don't know if I'll be successful but I sure do hope I can find something hybrid. This isn't the friendliest town either and I like to keep my distance. I'm happy to hear that you are still practicing safety. I think people get mad when they see my mask. It's truly bizarre.
We were lucky enough to get an Thanksgiving/Friendsgiving invite again this year so we won't have to be alone. I'm not sure if everyone will be vaxxed, but we are.

Happy Holidays everyone. Try to stay calm when the stress threatens. We are also asking the Universe for kindness for this new year. We need a good year after so much strife and grief.