Coronavirus discussion

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herbalhippie
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by herbalhippie »

Greyfeather wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 3:43 am Sorry about the double post :roll:
I saw that on my phone just now when I woke up. I was going to come out to my desktop and fix it for you but you beat me to it.

I was hoping I'd get the 5G from mix n match but my son told me last night for 5G you have to get a shot of Pfizer, Moderna AND J&J.
So I guess I'll have to settle for being magnetic.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by INSENSE3 »

Definitely not bad being magnetic! People stick with magnetism! :D

@Brave777 thank you for the enjoyable reading in the last post, especially! No matter who is right about what, it makes for humorous reading and your PASSION is what makes it endearingly special, no matter a few complaints! Keep on keeping on!

THANK YOU everyone for sharing your absolutely touching experiences with this dam lifelong virus and its mutations…
The enjoyment in reading some of the posts here is CERTAINLY NOT meant to minimize the true depth of serious loss and anxiety/depression, income loss and overall, ongoing monetary devastation and introduction to poverty, previously known as the middle class.

Please take good care and stay well,

CLOCKS BACK THIS WEEKEND !!!

Have a great weekend, too!

Laurie

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Last edited by INSENSE3 on Thu Nov 11, 2021 9:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Greyfeather »

herbalhippie wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 8:58 am
Greyfeather wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 3:43 am Sorry about the double post :roll:
I saw that on my phone just now when I woke up. I was going to come out to my desktop and fix it for you but you beat me to it.

I was hoping I'd get the 5G from mix n match but my son told me last night for 5G you have to get a shot of Pfizer, Moderna AND J&J.
So I guess I'll have to settle for being magnetic.
Thanks for that, hh :D

Personally I'm finding the magnetism very handy. My Guy and I are building our own bed. Before we get started he just tosses all of the tools at me. I'm quite the picture with the drill sitting fashionably on one shoulder, the handsaw clinging to my....hand, and a hammer hanging from my @ss. I'd post a photo but then all the kids would be doing it :lol:

Stay well and give your son a hug from his Auntie Grey.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by herbalhippie »

^^^ Great visuals!!
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Greyfeather »

herbalhippie wrote: Sat Nov 06, 2021 8:37 pm ^^^ Great visuals!!

<3 <3 <3
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by INSENSE3 »

I know, right?!
🤗

♥️ 💜♥️💜♥️
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by KalieGirl »

herbalhippie wrote: Tue Oct 12, 2021 11:15 pm r/HermanCainAward

holy hell....

I've been reading at the nursing and medical subs. There's a lot of discussion about the difference in patients from
last winter's outbreak and the delta varant outbreak. Lots of nurses talking about how so many patients in this
outbreak are just plain nasty and mean. One nurse said today that normally she'd have 1 or 2 patients out of
10 that are not pleasant, now it's like 1 patient out of 10 that are pleasant and co-operative. Nurses and doctors
sound tired and fed up and pissed off.
Hippie where exactly are these subs? I am very interested in reading the commentary
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herbalhippie
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by herbalhippie »

KalieGirl wrote: Tue Nov 16, 2021 10:44 am
herbalhippie wrote: Tue Oct 12, 2021 11:15 pm r/HermanCainAward

holy hell....

I've been reading at the nursing and medical subs. There's a lot of discussion about the difference in patients from
last winter's outbreak and the delta varant outbreak. Lots of nurses talking about how so many patients in this
outbreak are just plain nasty and mean. One nurse said today that normally she'd have 1 or 2 patients out of
10 that are not pleasant, now it's like 1 patient out of 10 that are pleasant and co-operative. Nurses and doctors
sound tired and fed up and pissed off.
Hippie where exactly are these subs? I am very interested in reading the commentary
Here is r/medicine.

https://old.reddit.com/r/medicine/

Here is r/nursing where you'll find more discussion about it. r/medicine is probably less for discussion about the awfulness of patients and more about the awfulness of the virus. Less 'gossipy' as it were. lol

https://old.reddit.com/r/nursing/
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by KalieGirl »

Thank you!!
I am not experienced with Reddit and the links go to general message board. How do I search for specific topics like covid infections, variants, and vaccines? Just use the search feature? Include hashtags yes or no?
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by herbalhippie »

KalieGirl wrote: Tue Nov 16, 2021 10:52 am Thank you!!
I am not experienced with Reddit and the links go to general message board. How do I search for specific topics like covid infections, variants, and vaccines? Just use the search feature? Include hashtags yes or no?
When I am searching for something I go to 'Home' and then type whatever in the search bar. It will give you some subs on top and then separate threads underneath that. There are LOTS of Covid subs.

I am subbed to r/coronavirus, r/coronavirusus, r/coronaviruswa

You can search inside each sub too, if you're looking for specifics like variants. Reddit is one big rabbit hole. :lol:
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by KalieGirl »

Thanks Hippie!
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by SeventhHeaven »

Something I learned a few weeks ago - there are studies in Pakistan showing a combination of raw honey and ground Nigella Sativa (black cumin) seeds being VERY effective at treating COVID-19. In that part of the world they eat a lot of those seeds, and there's a saying - "Nigella Sativa seeds cure everything but death".

Do a search on YouTube for "raw honey nigella sativa dr been" - you'll see a chart in the search results, that's it.

I told someone who was pretty sick with covid on another forum about this - her oxygen sat in the mid-to-high 80s - and a couple of days later she was healthy. Pretty amazing. Shocked both of us!

The video talks about how much to use per body weight.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by INSENSE3 »

Hey welcome @SeventhHeaven!

Looks like we have another perspective on the board! Cool!

Hope everyone here is feeling well despite the challenges that found us in seek of kratom in the first place.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Kalico »

SeventhHeaven wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:28 am Something I learned a few weeks ago - there are studies in Pakistan showing a combination of raw honey and ground Nigella Sativa (black cumin) seeds being VERY effective at treating COVID-19. In that part of the world they eat a lot of those seeds, and there's a saying - "Nigella Sativa seeds cure everything but death".

Do a search on YouTube for "raw honey nigella sativa dr been" - you'll see a chart in the search results, that's it.

I told someone who was pretty sick with covid on another forum about this - her oxygen sat in the mid-to-high 80s - and a couple of days later she was healthy. Pretty amazing. Shocked both of us!

The video talks about how much to use per body weight.
Better known to this forum as black seed oil, but this is the raw seeds the oil is extracted from.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by IndelibleDotInk »

Anyone get a booster shot yet?
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

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IndelibleDotInk wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 9:12 am Anyone get a booster shot yet?
Me and two of my four kids. Another one will this weekend with her boyfriend. Other one I'm
still working on. She just started a new job so she's been pretty busy. She had Moderna for
her first two so she's probably still ok. Me and the other three had Pfizer and we all got, or
are getting, Moderna boosters.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by IndelibleDotInk »

I had moderna. Got to convicne my mom to get her second shot, my aunty is filling her head with nutso misinformation.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by PistolsAtDawn »

I got a Pfizer booster (because that's the same brand as the last two). I ran a minor fever the next day and had extra body aches for a couple of days, but that was a lighter reaction than the second dose. I'm glad to know that my body does indeed respond better than before. That's the whole point, right?

The one thing that makes me a bit sad is that not all of the world has access to the vaccine even after most of a year since it became available. It does feel a bit unfair to have received three shots when others - who really want and need it - can't get it at all. I wish it weren't that way. My immune system is trying to kill me already, so I got it to help keep me safe. There are many reports of Covid making fibromyalgia pain worse, so anecdotal or not, I'm not going to take a chance on that.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by herbalhippie »

IndelibleDotInk wrote: Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:17 am I had moderna. Got to convicne my mom to get her second shot, my aunty is filling her head with nutso misinformation.
Oh no! Yeah, fill her head with anti-nutso information. She only had the one shot of two? She might have to start over.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by INSENSE3 »

Hey y’all 👩‍🦳!

@IndelibleDotInk, hope that’s right. I mix up the letters on your handle most every time. Not trying to be disrespectful. Scrolling is fine for checking spelling, but sometimes I can’t find my way back to the reply I’m writing, lol.

Yes, I got all Moderna shots to include a booster last week. I didn’t feel well for a couple of days after that, maybe 3 days. My arm hurt a lot for 24 hours, so I had trouble getting comfortable to sleep. Comfort was difficult to find, so sleep was not good for the first 2 nights. Then I needed constant sleep or naps for a couple of days. Day 3 was the last day where I slept A LOT.

Just lazy me again now.

Hope everyone had a good day filled with health and a few giggles,

Night,
Laurie
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by IndelibleDotInk »

It's too late for mom, she has settled on not taking any further vaccine therapy. :roll:
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

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IndelibleDotInk wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:33 am It's too late for mom, she has settled on not taking any further vaccine therapy. :roll:
I am sorry to hear that, Mike. This must be stressful for you.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

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That’s too bad about mom. Mine has been ok with getting vaccinated and good thing because she forgets to consider safety protocols.

A lot of people are making a fuss about the hassles of a booster. COVID certainly has been annoying.

I’m not a passionate vax or don’t vax to the point of inability to engage in conversation with other people with their own rights to their own actions and opinions and I don’t tell people what to eat because I know more about certain dietary lifestyles.

The deal is, I’m glad there are vaccinations at all, for my needs. Compromised immune system. Probably my fault. I should have eaten what other people tell me to, I suppose. LOL

If millions of us drop dead as predicted, from having been lured into vaccines, the remaining people without vaccines will have an unbelievable opportunity to FIX THE PLANET now that half of the population is gone. That should be helpful. Climate change might respond favorably to the sudden population adjustment. I hope this opportunity does not get wasted.

Please tell everyone I loved trying to be helpful and LESS IS STILL MORE for optimal kratom use benefits. 👍

Yes, I’m a smart a&& with a dark sarcastic humor streak. Please don’t let my post offend anyone. It’s NOT INTENDED to do anything but maybe share a giggle as we all continue moving forward into the unknown…

Laurie
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Loveandpeace »

INSENSE3 wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:32 pm That’s too bad about mom. Mine has been ok with getting vaccinated and good thing because she forgets to consider safety protocols.

Regarding mothers-- my mom was acting foolish and started spouting some of that Fox patented bullshit. Me and my gal shut it down. We said, we are trying to get pregnant (I am the only chance/gay brother). If we do make a kid and something dire happens, you won't be able to vaccinate quick enough for any necessary hospital visits. It worked.

Now... we need her to see the chemo light.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by herbalhippie »

INSENSE3 wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:32 pm

If millions of us drop dead as predicted, from having been lured into vaccines, the remaining people without vaccines will have an unbelievable opportunity to FIX THE PLANET now that half of the population is gone. That should be helpful. Climate change might respond favorably to the sudden population adjustment. I hope this opportunity does not get wasted.

We would hope. Unfortunately, the ones who are getting vaccinated are also the ones who tend to care about such things as climate change and more. So I don't know how much fixing would be done. As you say, just a drop in population should help.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by MetalMamaRocks »

INSENSE3 wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:32 pm Yes, I’m a smart a&& with a dark sarcastic humor streak. Please don’t let my post offend anyone. It’s NOT INTENDED to do anything but maybe share a giggle as we all continue moving forward into the unknown…
Hey Laurie, we need more giggles in this world! It's been so serious and full of hate, but there are still moments of joy if we look for them.

I went to a baby shower yesterday and it was so sweet and full of love and just what I needed! Of course covid and the chance of getting it was on my mind, but I'm triple vaccinated and wore a mask and sometimes we have to trust the vaccines will do their job.

Speaking of jobs, I'm getting ready for a 12 hour shift today and I'm going to go in and crack jokes and try to make people laugh! 🤣🤣🤣
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

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KalieGirl wrote: Tue Nov 16, 2021 10:44 am
herbalhippie wrote: Tue Oct 12, 2021 11:15 pm r/HermanCainAward

holy hell....

I've been reading at the nursing and medical subs. There's a lot of discussion about the difference in patients from
last winter's outbreak and the delta varant outbreak. Lots of nurses talking about how so many patients in this
outbreak are just plain nasty and mean. One nurse said today that normally she'd have 1 or 2 patients out of
10 that are not pleasant, now it's like 1 patient out of 10 that are pleasant and co-operative. Nurses and doctors
sound tired and fed up and pissed off.
Hippie where exactly are these subs? I am very interested in reading the commentary
Here's a story from a thread today. THIS is the kind of people the nurses are deal with

"Had a COVID+ patient on a PCU level who was on high oxygen requirements. Patient was a complete asshole to everyone, fired 4 nurses the day before and 3 that day before 11am. He was on the rapid list so they asked me to help out.

Guy called me every name in the book, 40 year AAOx4, obese as hell. When I moved the patients arm to get to the IV, I was told “haven’t you learned anything? When people hurt me without apologizing I’m going to start swinging, then you’ll learn.”

I stood up and said “make my day. Do it, I dare you.” On Opti-flow mind you. Patient calls mom, and I’m thinking that maybe she will talk the patient down.

Mom proceeds to get into my face and threaten me as well, so it was apparent the apple didn’t fall far from that tree. Mom and patient told me if I didn’t give the patient the food when he was ready (and they also added the “it better be the dinner I ordered or somebody about to get hit and fired”) they would leave the hospital. I said “I’ll grab you a form and you can go.”

Proceeded to sign AMA. Then scream at me because I wouldn’t give them an oxygen tank or a wheelchair. Patient goes “I can barely walk because of my foot pain (neuropathy), where’s my wheelchair.” I said “you signed out AMA, how you leave the hospital is your problem now.”

Mom proceeded to take patient home, not before she put blankets in the sink, turn on the water, and flood the entire room."


Here's another

"Guy who would deSAT from everything and was getting close to being intubated. He was tired, he wanted it, but his family was freaking nuts. He wouldn’t even talk to them after a certain point. His wife was livid that we wouldn’t give him this and that treatment/medications she heard about from her “doctor friend” (aka Facebook memes) because they weren’t approved for hospital use, would cancel out his medications, kill him, or simply do nothing. She signed him out AMA and my heart literally broke while watching him be wheeled out on a stretcher gasping for air and looking confused while his wife trailed behind with her arms crossed and looking pissed off. I looked him up a week later and saw his obituary stating he passed that same day. And you know she blamed us for his death."
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by MetalMamaRocks »

Hippie, that's terrible! No wonder nurses are quitting in droves.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by StringThing »

MetalMamaRocks wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:30 am Hippie, that's terrible! No wonder nurses are quitting in droves.
I have heard that traveling nurses are making like 2-4x the normal wage right now because hospitals are so strapped for nurses.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by StringThing »

SeventhHeaven wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:28 am Something I learned a few weeks ago - there are studies in Pakistan showing a combination of raw honey and ground Nigella Sativa (black cumin) seeds being VERY effective at treating COVID-19. In that part of the world they eat a lot of those seeds, and there's a saying - "Nigella Sativa seeds cure everything but death".

Do a search on YouTube for "raw honey nigella sativa dr been" - you'll see a chart in the search results, that's it.

I told someone who was pretty sick with covid on another forum about this - her oxygen sat in the mid-to-high 80s - and a couple of days later she was healthy. Pretty amazing. Shocked both of us!

The video talks about how much to use per body weight.
I generally don't trust YouTube videos for medical information. You have no idea if what they're saying is true. I pay attention to studies.

Just look at Ivermectin. Effective for treating COVID-19, but the high dose required to actually treat symptoms is not worth it and will potentially give you such bad hypertension you have a heart attack. This is why it isn't being used. There are better drugs.

Many plants with immunosupportive properties are getting touted as 'cures' for COVID-19 right now. But if I get COVID, I'm not going to be taking fucking CBD lol. I'm going to take what the medical community recommends. Not just something I saw on a youtube video, even if there is a doctor or scientists presenting it. Many doctors and scientists throughout history have been wrong. That's why we listen to scientific consensus.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by SeventhHeaven »

I found the YouTube video after reading TWO studies in Pakistan using Nigella Sativa seeds and raw honey to very successfully treat COVID-19. The video essentially goes over one of those studies and adds more information. Plus, he's interesting to listen to :D
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Babel-17 »

Role of ivermectin in the prevention of SARS-CoV-2 infection among healthcare workers in India: A matched case-control study
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33592050/
Results: Ivermectin prophylaxis was taken by 76 controls and 41 cases. Two-dose ivermectin prophylaxis (AOR 0.27, 95% CI, 0.15-0.51) was associated with a 73% reduction of SARS-CoV-2 infection among healthcare workers for the following month. Those involved in physical activity (AOR 3.06 95% CI, 1.18-7.93) for more than an hour/day were more likely to contract SARS-CoV-2 infection. Type of household, COVID duty, single-dose ivermectin prophylaxis, vitamin-C prophylaxis and hydroxychloroquine prophylaxis were not associated with SARS-CoV-2 infection.

Conclusion: Two-dose ivermectin prophylaxis at a dose of 300 μg/kg with a gap of 72 hours was associated with a 73% reduction of SARS-CoV-2 infection among healthcare workers for the following month. Chemoprophylaxis has relevance in the containment of pandemic.
Prophylactic Role of Ivermectin in Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome Coronavirus 2 Infection Among Healthcare Workers
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34513470/
Participants who took ivermectin prophylaxis had a lower risk of getting symptoms suggestive of SARS-CoV-2 infection (6% vs 15%). HCWs who had taken two doses of oral ivermectin had a significantly lower risk of contracting COVID-19 infection during the following month (ARR 0.17; 95% CI, 0.12-0.23). Females had a lower risk of contracting COVID-19 than males (ARR 0.70; 95% CI, 0.52-0.93). The absolute risk reduction of SARS-CoV-2 infection was 9.7%. Only 1.8% of the participants reported adverse events, which were mild and self-limiting. Conclusion Two doses of oral ivermectin (300 μg/kg/dose given 72 hours apart) as chemoprophylaxis among HCWs reduced the risk of COVID-19 infection by 83% in the following month. Safe, effective, and low-cost chemoprophylaxis has relevance in the containment of pandemic alongside vaccine.
https://www.who.int/india/news/feature- ... p-covid-19

Apparently Ivermectin has been part of "the secret sauce" used in the kits referred to in the WHO article above.

https://www.thedesertreview.com/opinion ... 2647b.html
On August 6, 2021, India’s Ivermectin media blackout ended with MSN reporting. Western media, including MSN, finally acknowledged what was contained in those Uttar Pradesh medicine kits. Among the medicines were Doxycycline and Ivermectin.

https://trialsitenews.com/msn-showcases ... cine-kits/

On August 25, 2021, the Indian media noticed the discrepancy between Uttar Pradesh's massive success and other states, like Kerala's, comparative failure. Although Uttar Pradesh was only 5% vaccinated to Kerala's 20%, Uttar Pradesh had (only) 22 new COVID cases, while Kerala was overwhelmed with 31,445 in one day. So it became apparent that whatever was contained in those treatment kits must have been pretty effective.

News18 reported, "Let’s look at the contrasting picture. Kerala, with its 3.5 crore population - or 35 million, on August 25 reported 31,445 new cases, a bulk of the total cases reported in the country. Uttar Pradesh, the biggest state with a population of nearly 24 crore - or 240 million - meanwhile reported just 22 cases in the same period.

Two days ago, just seven fresh positive cases were reported from Uttar Pradesh. Kerala reported 215 deaths on August 25, while Uttar Pradesh only reported two deaths. In fact, no deaths have been reported from Uttar Pradesh in recent days. There are only 345 active cases in Uttar Pradesh now while Kerala’s figure is at 1.7 lakh - or 170,000."

https://www.news18.com/news/india/tale- ... 27714.html
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Babel-17 »

Why COVID-19 is not so spread in Africa: How does Ivermectin affect
it?

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 1.full.pdf
Objective: To evaluate the impact of ivermectin interventions for onchocerciasis on the morbidity,
mortality, recovery, and fatality rates caused by COVID-19.

Method: A retrospective statistical analysis study of the impact of ivermectin against COVID-19
between the 31 onchocerciasis-endemic countries using the community-directed treatment with
ivermectin (CDTI) and the non-endemic 22 countries in Africa. The morbidity, mortality, recovery
rate, and fatality rate caused by COVID-19 were calculated from the WHO situation report in Africa.
We investigated the onchocerciasis endemic 31 countries and the non-endemic 22 countries.
Statistical comparisons used by the Welch test of them in the two groups were made.

Results: The morbidity and mortality were statistically significantly less in the 31 countries using
CDTI. The recovery and fatality rates were not statistically significant difference. The average life
expectancy was statistically significantly higher in the non-endemic countries.

Conclusions: The morbidity and mortality in the onchocerciasis endemic countries are lesser than
those in the non-endemic ones. The community-directed onchocerciasis treatment with ivermectin is
the most reasonable explanation for the decrease in morbidity and fatality rate in Africa. In areas
where ivermectin is distributed to and used by the entire population, it leads to a significant
reduction in mortality.
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PistolsAtDawn
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by PistolsAtDawn »

All of that still means that a vaccine is the undisputed best way to fight Covid. Keeping it from spreading is so much more effective than worrying about treating it with horse dewormer that comes with dangerous side effects because of the huge dosage necessary for it to have any effect.

Notice that all of this "research" isn't confirmed by western medicine, there is no scientific consensus that horse dewormer is superior to a vaccine, and all these armchair experts who are claiming otherwise don't have the education necessary to truly understand what they're spreading.

Doctors in western medicine are refusing to use ivermectin as a treatment because it's dangerous. Full stop.

I've had three vaccine shots now, and I haven't caught Covid, so there's no need for me to worry about a "treatment" cooked up by right-wing conspiracy theorists.

"I've never held a wrench in my life, and my car isn't working, but I know better than a mechanic how to fix it because I watched some uneducated rando on YouTube tell me I'm smarter than a professional."

Meanwhile the unvaccinated are the only people spreading and dying from Covid.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Babel-17 »

It appears to be the case that billions of doses of Ivermectin have been administered to people.

And it's being used in parts of India in addition to COVID-19 vaccines. In Africa, people have been taking it for decades, and it appears to be the case that's why scientists were to notice in surprise that Africa's numbers in regards deaths and severe illness were much lower than anticipated.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8248252/
Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of COVID-19 Infection: A Systematic Review, Meta-analysis, and Trial Sequential Analysis to Inform Clinical Guidelines

Background:

Repurposed medicines may have a role against the SARS-CoV-2 virus. The antiparasitic ivermectin, with antiviral and anti-inflammatory properties, has now been tested in numerous clinical trials.
Areas of uncertainty:

We assessed the efficacy of ivermectin treatment in reducing mortality, in secondary outcomes, and in chemoprophylaxis, among people with, or at high risk of, COVID-19 infection.
Data sources:

We searched bibliographic databases up to April 25, 2021. Two review authors sifted for studies, extracted data, and assessed risk of bias. Meta-analyses were conducted and certainty of the evidence was assessed using the GRADE approach and additionally in trial sequential analyses for mortality. Twenty-four randomized controlled trials involving 3406 participants met review inclusion.
Therapeutic Advances:

Meta-analysis of 15 trials found that ivermectin reduced risk of death compared with no ivermectin (average risk ratio 0.38, 95% confidence interval 0.19–0.73; n = 2438; I2 = 49%; moderate-certainty evidence). This result was confirmed in a trial sequential analysis using the same DerSimonian–Laird method that underpinned the unadjusted analysis. This was also robust against a trial sequential analysis using the Biggerstaff–Tweedie method. Low-certainty evidence found that ivermectin prophylaxis reduced COVID-19 infection by an average 86% (95% confidence interval 79%–91%). Secondary outcomes provided less certain evidence. Low-certainty evidence suggested that there may be no benefit with ivermectin for “need for mechanical ventilation,” whereas effect estimates for “improvement” and “deterioration” clearly favored ivermectin use. Severe adverse events were rare among treatment trials and evidence of no difference was assessed as low certainty. Evidence on other secondary outcomes was very low certainty.
Conclusions:

Moderate-certainty evidence finds that large reductions in COVID-19 deaths are possible using ivermectin. Using ivermectin early in the clinical course may reduce numbers progressing to severe disease. The apparent safety and low cost suggest that ivermectin is likely to have a significant impact on the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic globally.


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043740/
Ivermectin, ‘Wonder drug’ from Japan: the human use perspective

Abstract

Discovered in the late-1970s, the pioneering drug ivermectin, a dihydro derivative of avermectin—originating solely from a single microorganism isolated at the Kitasato Intitute, Tokyo, Japan from Japanese soil—has had an immeasurably beneficial impact in improving the lives and welfare of billions of people throughout the world. Originally introduced as a veterinary drug, it kills a wide range of internal and external parasites in commercial livestock and companion animals. It was quickly discovered to be ideal in combating two of the world’s most devastating and disfiguring diseases which have plagued the world’s poor throughout the tropics for centuries. It is now being used free-of-charge as the sole tool in campaigns to eliminate both diseases globally. It has also been used to successfully overcome several other human diseases and new uses for it are continually being found. This paper looks in depth at the events surrounding ivermectin’s passage from being a huge success in Animal Health into its widespread use in humans, a development which has led many to describe it as a “wonder” drug.
Keywords: avermectin, ivermectin, mode of action, onchocerciasis, lymphatic filariasis, drug resistance
Go to:
Introduction

There are few drugs that can seriously lay claim to the title of ‘Wonder drug’, penicillin and aspirin being two that have perhaps had greatest beneficial impact on the health and wellbeing of Mankind. But ivermectin can also be considered alongside those worthy contenders, based on its versatility, safety and the beneficial impact that it has had, and continues to have, worldwide—especially on hundreds of millions of the world’s poorest people. Several extensive reports, including reviews authored by us, have been published detailing the events behind the discovery, development and commercialization of the avermectins and ivermectin (22,23-dihydroavermectin B), as well as the donation of ivermectin and its use in combating Onchocerciasis and lymphatic filariasis.1–6) However, none have concentrated in detail on the interacting sequence of events involved in the passage of the drug into human use.

When it first appeared in the late-1970s, ivermectin, a derivative of avermectin (Fig. ​(Fig.1 )1 ) was a truly revolutionary drug, unprecedented in many ways. It was the world’s first endectocide, forerunner of a completely new class of antiparasitic agents, potently active against a wide range of internal and external nematodes and arthropods. In the early-1970s, a novel international Public Sector–Private Sector partnership was initiated by one of us (Ōmura, then head of the Antibiotics Research Group at Tokyo’s Kitasato Institute), forming a collaboration with the US-based Merck, Sharp and Dohme (MSD) pharmaceutical company. Under the terms of the research agreement, researchers at the Kitasato Institute isolated organisms from soil samples and carried out preliminary in vitro evaluation of their bioactivity. Promising bioactive samples were then sent to the MSD laboratories for further in vivo testing where a potent and promising novel bioactivity was found, subsequently identified as being caused by a new compound, which was named ‘avermectin’.7) Despite decades of searching around the world, the Japanese microorganism remains the only source of avermectin ever found.1) Originating from a single Japanese soil sample and the outcome of the innovative, international collaborative research partnership to find new antiparasitics, the extremely safe and more effective avermectin derivative, ivermectin, was initially introduced as a commercial product for Animal Health in 1981. It is effective against a wide range of parasites, including gastrointestinal roundworms, lungworms, mites, lice and hornflies.7–12) Ivermectin is also highly effective against ticks, for example, the ixodid tick Rhipicephalus (Boophilus) microplus, one of the most important cattle parasites in the tropics and subtropics, which causes enormous economic damage. Indicative of the impact, in Brazil, where some 80% of the bovine herd is infested, losses total about $2 billion annually.13) Today, ivermectin is being used to treat billions of livestock and pets around the world, helping to boost production of food and leather products, as well as keep billions of companion animals, particularly dogs and horses, healthy. The ‘Blockbuster’ drug in the Animal Health sector, meaning that it achieved annual sales in excess of over US$1 billion, maintained that status for over 20 years. It is so useful and adaptable that it is also being used off-label, sometimes, illegally, for example to treat fish lice in the aquaculture industry, where it can have a negative impact on non-target organisms. It also has extensive uses in agriculture.2)

Ivermectin proved to be even more of a ‘Wonder drug’ in human health, improving the nutrition, general health and wellbeing of billions of people worldwide ever since it was first used to treat Onchocerciasis in humans in 1988. It proved ideal in many ways, being highly effective and broad-spectrum, safe, well tolerated and could be easily administered (a single, annual oral dose). It is used to treat a variety of internal nematode infections, including Onchocerciasis, Strongyloidiasis, Ascariasis, cutaneous larva migrans, filariases, Gnathostomiasis and Trichuriasis, as well as for oral treatment of ectoparasitic infections, such as Pediculosis (lice infestation) and scabies (mite infestation).14) Ivermectin is the essential mainstay of two global disease elimination campaigns that should soon rid the world of two of its most disfiguring and devastating diseases, Onchocerciasis and Lymphatic filariasis, which blight the lives of billions of the poor and disadvantaged throughout the tropics. It is likely that, throughout the next decade, well over 200 million people will be taking the drug annually or semi-annually, via innovative globally-coordinated Mass Drug Administration (MDA) programmes. Indeed, the discovery, development and deployment of ivermectin, produced by an unprecedented partnership between the Private Sector pharmaceutical multinational Merck & Co. Inc., and the Public Sector Kitasato Institute in Tokyo, aided by an extraordinary coalition of multidisciplinary international partners and disease-affected communities, has been recognized by many experts and observers as one of the greatest medical accomplishments of the 20th century.15) In referring to the international efforts to tackle Onchocerciasis in which ivermectin is now the sole control tool, the UNESCO World Science Report concluded, “the progress that has been made in combating the disease represents one of the most triumphant public health campaigns ever waged in the developing world”.16)
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by Lokey »

So, currently in the US, cases reported and deaths are on the rise, including children (Europe also). I've had three Phizer shots. I had sore arm, fever, slight dizziness and fatigue from first, sore arm, slight fever and fatigue from second, and extremely sore arm and fatigue from the third (or so it seemed). Who knows if the fatigue is other things. I'm concerned because the vaccines don't last long and the virus is not quitting. I'm fortunate I can work from home, the pandemic was a blessing to me in that regard because working in an office had become too difficult for me before the pandemic and I was just hanging on due to pain issues. I feel so lucky I get to work afternoons only and from home because mornings are hard. But I still wear a mask when I go anywhere, have not eaten in a restaurant or socialized other than with my mom and sister in over a year. However, my sister exposes herself by socializing a lot and no longer wearing a mask. She's got three shots also but that's no guarantee. My mom's 87 (also three Phizer shots) and I'm 68, sis is 67. I also live with my son who is 31 and goes out to work, as a lifeguard and assistant at a private club. He's had two Phizer shots. So I feel my sister and son endanger me more than going out in my mask and using hand sanitizer. I doubt I'd refuse Ivermectin if I was sick and it could possibly help but if it does I'd think it'd be used more often? Research doesn't help, in fact it's very scary, and I think it's better to focus on prevention. Also other treatments aren't readily available to everyone, monoclonal antibodies? Those are after the fact, no guarantees. Like the saying just death and taxes. I think I've become too weary from all the politics and controversy, and I know I should remain vigilant.
Last edited by Lokey on Tue Nov 23, 2021 10:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by SeventhHeaven »

StringThing wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 9:51 am
SeventhHeaven wrote: Thu Nov 18, 2021 11:28 am Something I learned a few weeks ago - there are studies in Pakistan showing a combination of raw honey and ground Nigella Sativa (black cumin) seeds being VERY effective at treating COVID-19 >snip<
>snip<
But if I get COVID, I'm not going to be taking fucking CBD lol. I'm going to take what the medical community recommends.
>snip<
I decided I should issue a mild response to this. Nigella Sativa has nothing to do with CBD. Nigella Sativa is not a strain of cannabis :o It's black cumin, and the seeds, as I said, are used for medical purposes (and as a food spice) in many places in the world. Both it and raw honey are well known to have anti-viral properties, which is why the two (2) studies I read from Pakistan showed remarkable results for treating COVID-19, actually better than either Ivermectin or Hydroxychloroquine in the later stages of Teh Covids™.

Incidentally, Ivermectin is only secondarily a "horse de-wormer". Its inventor, in fact, won a Nobel Prize in 2015 for Ivermectin's use in human medicine :D
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by SeventhHeaven »

PS - Thanks, Babel-17, for the info on Ivermectin use in Africa, I've read it as well. India too :)
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by IjustFeltLikeRunnin’ »

I think it is important to note, that the majority of the “studies” listed above are purely observational. These are not large scale with any kind of rigorous controls put into place. No controls involving any other kind of mitigating factors the “participants” might have utilized (i.e. mask-wearing, the amount of hand sanitizing any individual may have done on a daily basis, etc).

https://www.albertahealthservices.ca/as ... review.pdf
KEY FINDINGS
• The studies evaluating ivermectin treatment are not high enough quality to
properly decide if ivermectin is useful or not. Most studies did not clearly describe the effect of the other medications given to patients or what other factors might influence their findings (“confounding”), did not have an adequate comparator group to assess if there was a difference in patients given ivermectin, or were too small to be sure that any effect of ivermectin seen was real.
• With respect to ivermectin's ability to prevent infection with COVID-19, four low quality studies showed that ivermectin may reduce the risk of COVID-19 infection; however, there were several confounding factors and we don’t know what else the study participants were doing that might have influenced their risk of infection. More studies are needed to show if ivermectin can be used to prevent infection.
• With respect to ivermectin's ability to treat people with COVID-19, seven studies that had a control group (ie. a group of participants that did not receive ivermectin) reported the effect of ivermectin on death from COVID-19. Four showed that deaths from COVID-19 went down, while three showed that deaths from COVID-19 were not affected. All seven studies were small and were of low or very low quality, so we can’t be sure that their findings were real. More studies are needed to show if ivermectin can be used to treat COVID-19.
Strength of Evidence
Overall, the evidence for this topic is of very low to low quality. As with other clinical topics on COVID-19, the research on ivermectin is opportunistic and hastily done, with limited planning to minimize sources of bias. The body of evidence is at high risk of bias due to confounding, as many studies investigated ivermectin as add-on therapy to a cocktail of medications intended to manage symptoms and limit viral replication. Small sample sizes, performance bias, short follow-up time, inappropriate study designs, further limit the usefulness of the available evidence on ivermectin. Further, the evidence is not consistent for any outcome of COVID-19 treatment (such as PCR positivity, symptom resolution, days in hospital, or mortality).
The majority of studies are from Southeast Asia and Latin America, both regions with notably different healthcare systems, population health statistics and epidemic dynamics.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33592050/
Role of ivermectin in the prevention of SARS-CoV-2 infection among healthcare workers in India: A matched case-control study

Priyamadhaba Behera 1 , Binod Kumar Patro 1 , Arvind Kumar Singh 1 , Pradnya Dilip Chandanshive 1 , Ravikumar S R 1 , Somen Kumar Pradhan 1 , Siva Santosh Kumar Pentapati 1 , Gitanjali Batmanabane 2 , Prasanta Raghab Mohapatra 3 , Biswa Mohan Padhy 4 , Shakti Kumar Bal 3 , Sudipta Ranjan Singh 5 , Rashmi Ranjan Mohanty 6
Affiliations expand
PMID: 33592050 PMCID: PMC7886121 DOI: 10.1371/journal.pone.0247163
Free PMC article
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Abstract

Background: Ivermectin is one among several potential drugs explored for its therapeutic and preventive role in SARS-CoV-2 infection. The study was aimed to explore the association between ivermectin prophylaxis and the development of SARS-CoV-2 infection among healthcare workers.

Methods: A hospital-based matched case-control study was conducted among healthcare workers of AIIMS Bhubaneswar, India, from September to October 2020. Profession, gender, age and date of diagnosis were matched for 186 case-control pairs. Cases and controls were healthcare workers who tested positive and negative, respectively, for COVID-19 by RT-PCR. Exposure was defined as the intake of ivermectin and/or hydroxychloroquine and/or vitamin-C and/or other prophylaxis for COVID-19. Data collection and entry was done in Epicollect5, and analysis was performed using STATA version 13. Conditional logistic regression models were used to describe the associated factors for SARS-CoV-2 infection.
Really?! One month worth of data? People are freaking out over “how quickly the vaccines were put out”, but are willing to take one month worth of data of a drug being used in an off-label way, in an uncontrolled “study”, as gospel proof?




https://www.albertahealthservices.ca/as ... review.pdf

BACKGROUND
• Ivermectin is used to treat parasitic infections (such as intestinal worms or lice) in
both humans and animals. Ivermectin is generally safe when used according to the label, but can cause mild side effects like nausea, diarrhea, fatigue, dizziness, and rash.
• Laboratory studies performed in monkey cells showed that ivermectin is able to stop the virus that causes COVID-19 from growing in cells. This raised interest in ivermectin as a potential treatment for COVID-19, even though many medicines that are effective in the laboratory are not effective when they are used in people.
• There is a lot of hype about ivermectin in social media, but it is still unclear if ivermectin actually prevents COVID-19 infection or is an effective treatment for COVID-19 because of the way studies have been done so far.
Key Messages from the Evidence Summary
• Ivermectin has been shown to inhibit viral replication in vitro, but at concentrations that may be unattainable with human therapeutic doses. Vero cells (a non-human cell line) infected with SARS-CoV-2 and treated with 5 μmol/L ivermectin at 2 hours post-infection showed a 5000X reduction in viral replication compared to untreated controls. However, the 100% inhibitory concentrations of ivermectin needed in vitro are approximately 50-55X higher than the maximum plasma concentration of ivermectin after an oral dose of 12 mg in adults.
• Studies evaluating ivermectin treatment are of inadequate quality for definitive assessment of ivermectin use in prophylaxis and therapy, with many studies involving incompletely described use of multiple other medications meant to manage symptoms and limit viral replication, inappropriate study design, inadequate controls, short follow-up length, performance bias, small sample sizes and high risk of bias from confounding factors.

I would like to add however, that it is exactly these types of observations that drive science. From the sounds of it, there are legitimate, large scale, controlled studies on ivermectin and several other potential preventions and treatments of COVID in the works as we speak. But unfortunately it takes longer than 1 month to acquire meaningful data in this fight.



The SAG and the Therapeutics Working Group will continue to monitor and assess new evidence on ivermectin as it is published. Several high quality randomized controlled trials are being conducted to further study the use of ivermectin for COVID-19; this review and recommendations will be updated as new evidence comes to light.
——————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————


In regards to the discrepancy of cases in certain states of India. A large scale antibody testing has taken place. Back in July, 71% of Uttar Pradesh residents tested positive for antibodies, and also has the highest rate of vaccination in the country.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/cities/l ... 46630.html
UP, which is India's most populous state has the highest number of vaccinations in the country at 47.5 million

Kerala on the other hand had the lowest rate of infection in the country, and therefore the lowest amount of people with antibodies.

https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-ne ... 91048.html

Kerala has had the lowest exposure to Sars-Cov-2, according to true infection estimates based on serological studies, new data by the Union government showed on Wednesday, with only 44% of the population projected to have been infected till early July compared to nearly 67% across the country as a whole.
According to experts, current infection trends and the new data by the Union health ministry offer two important insights: Kerala may have the least amount of under-reporting, and it has the most number of vulnerable people at present.
He added that this also means the second wave will “run longer for Kerala and Maharashtra because of less steep rise”.
To be sure, the fourth round of the sero study also included those who received vaccines. While the data released on Wednesday did not give a split between those with natural exposure and those with vaccine-mediated antibodies, the information released last week suggests the latter category accounts for a very small proportion: Of the 67.6% who had antibodies overall, 62% were not vaccinated, officials said at the time.
The overall sero survey results were released last week by the Union government and suggested two out of every three Indians may have been exposed to the virus. If extrapolated, this would mean roughly 900 million people have been infected by the virus; India’s official Covid-19 count on July 10 (when the survey ended) was 30 million.


https://www.albertahealthservices.ca/as ... review.pdf
Commentary on Ivermectin Use in Uttar Pradesh, India
Multiple social media sources have also reported that ivermectin might have been responsible for reducing COVID-19 cases in Uttar Pradesh, India, with claims that the low rate of new cases in spite of low vaccination rates in this region is related to distribution of ivermectin-containing medication kits. There are several potential issues with these lines of reasoning, including:
• Both observational trial data and “real world” data sources need careful evaluation using these key principles of review: expert peer review of evidence, assessment of errors in reporting, assessment of due scientific diligence, and careful consideration of confounders. These principles have not been applied to this data.
• This observational data is much lower quality evidence compared with randomized trials (which also can vary in quality and require assessment). There is variability in assessment of infection rates and outcome reporting at a population level, as well as confounding.
• Multiple sources suggest the infection rate and death toll of COVID-19 in India in general, and Uttar Pradesh in particular, has been underestimated and current transmission is likely lower because of post infection immunity in survivors given prior waves of the pandemic
o India’s death toll (and associated case counts) is estimated to be at least 7-13X higher than reported, suggesting actual population infection rates have been 60- 70%, confirmed by seroprevalence data. Multiple resources indicate that cremations outstripped official death estimates considerably in this area.
o A preprint analysis of excess mortality for India related to COVID-19 (which found up to 2% of the population died up to June, 2021) had to omit data from Uttar Pradesh because of significant reporting irregularities (including districts that reported NO deaths for months)
o Public health seroprevalence data reported by the Center for Global Development suggested extreme underreporting of cases and deaths in Uttar Pradesh, and Indian Council of Medical Research data (reported by press release) showed 71% seroprevalence in Uttar Pradesh in spite of only 29% initial dose vaccinated in July.
It is also noted that many districts in India used ivermectin over a period in which the evidence was less clear, based on national guidelines, so regions cannot be compared based on use or non-use. Ivermection and hydroxychloroquine have recently been removed from the national COVID-19 guidelines in India for lack of efficacy.
In summary, this would suggest Uttar Pradesh had a devastating prior COVID-19 surge with high case rates and significant uncounted mortality, with current evidence of partial population immunity in people who survived COVID-19 infection and increasing numbers of vaccinated people.

It appears to be more an issue of severe under reporting in this case.
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Re: Coronavirus discussion

Post by KalieGirl »

A friend sent me this article yesterday.
https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/abs/10. ... pl_1.10712
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